# Outside the Box > Philosophy and Debate >  >  DACA, And The Wealthiest Country In The World

## InvisibleGuy

This is the wealthiest country in the world. Our defense spending alone goes way, way beyond other countries, our budget for the defense department, our military expenditures is more than the next six countries* combined*.

This is sick, just sick. This is a president that has also taken away school lunch programs for kids. Ffs. I am fucking EMBARASSED to have this douchebag as our president, I really am. Ffs, I am really beyond disgusted.

I cannot believe this man is Commander In Chief of the USofA. I really cannot believe it. I'm disgusted. I love this country, but this kind of thing almost makes me want to move to another fucking country. I am beyond pissed off, beyond outraged.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zwhfpC-WryY

Watch this. It will scare the **** out of you if you are an American, and even if you're not. We're talking about 800,000 young people. Ffs, ffs, ffs.

What a racist, close-minded, ignorant and emotionally stunted mother fucker. I hate him, I hate him, I hate him.

BTW, I'm a white guy, that was born here, and my parents were born here, and so were their parents.....this just makes me sick.

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## InvisibleGuy

Dreamers did not, not, NOT decide to come here, and most, the overwhelming majority of them, did not break any laws. English is the only language they know, this country is the only place they know.

If you kick these children out of my country then that is beyond racist. That is sick. It is sadistic. How in the fuq....how...are you even a senator?

Oh. Wait. You're a reality tv host. My fault.

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## CloudMaker

GOOD!!! 

Their parents came here ILLEGALLY! If they want their kids to be here then they should come here LEGALLY just like EVERYBODY ELSE!

I don't care if you're black, white, or purple.... OUR BORDERS NEED TO BE RESPECTED!

Some people come here after waiting 2 years or MORE and it is not fair to them that we give some criminal's kids benefits for BREAKING THE LAW! MAGA!

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## InvisibleGuy

I don't want illegals here, just....FWIW....I really don't. There is a process. But this is just sick, imo.

You are forcing hundreds of thousands of children to now leave the only country they've ever known.

And.

You support this.

Wow. Just wow.

I don't even fucking have words to express how disgusted that makes me, I really don't....

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## kevinjoseph

I believe the average time it takes to legally immigrate to the USA is very very much longer than 2 years, and incredibly expensive.  So, not an option for many folks who don't have those luxuries of time and money.  BTW are you saying MAGA ironically because immigration is something that does indeed MAGA

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## InvisibleGuy

> I believe the average time it takes to legally immigrate to the USA is very very much longer than 2 years, and incredibly expensive.  So, not an option for many folks who don't have those luxuries of time and money.  BTW are you saying MAGA ironically because immigration is something that does indeed MAGA



You are confusing two very, veeeerrrry different issues. I totally realize it takes an incredible amount of time and money to immigrate legally to this country and I never said otherwise.

We aren't even talking about the same issue lol. You need to go back and read what this thread is about. I can't even respond to your post, because we aren't even talking about the same issue.

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## kevinjoseph

> You are confusing two very, veeeerrrry different issues. I totally realize it takes an incredible amount of time and money to immigrate legally to this country and I never said otherwise.
> 
> We aren't even talking about the same issue lol. You need to go back and read what this thread is about. I can't even respond to your post, because we aren't even talking about the same issue.



I was responding to Cloudmaker.

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## InvisibleGuy

My fault.

I actually would love to hear back from   
@CloudMaker
 as to what the difference is, in her mind, between these two issues. Because they are completely, totally different.

I would love to hear a rational argument as to why Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals should be ended.

I'm all ears. I'm waiting for your arguments. Just.

Waiting.

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## CloudMaker

> My fault.
> 
> I actually would love to hear back from   
> @CloudMaker
>  as to what the difference is, in her mind, between these two issues. Because they are completely, totally different.
> 
> I would love to hear a rational argument as to why Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals should be ended.
> 
> I'm all ears. I'm waiting for your arguments. Just.
> ...



Because you are REWARDING the children of CRIMINALS!!!!

If I drive down to Area 51 and pop out a kid does that mean they get to stay there? NO!!!!!! *THEY ARE NOT AUTHORIZED TO BE HERE!!!!*

Prosecute the parents and deport the kids! *MAGA!!!!!*

blurb.png

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## InvisibleGuy

Lmao, I am all over changing the process, and making it faster.

I live in an area with a very, very heavy illegal immigrant population.

So.

Again.

My question is very simple.

Why would you want to deport these children that are already here? This is the only home they know.....

Let's not be that ignorant. Please. Fffs ffs, ffs.

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## InvisibleGuy

Please don't tell me you are really that heartless.

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## InvisibleGuy

*** crickets chirping ****

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## JamieWAgain

For what it is worth, I think Trump is bluffing.

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## InvisibleGuy

I don't think so. And I don't think that you think I don't think so lol.

I think he really is this fucking stupid. I really do.

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## JamieWAgain

Time will tell.

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## InvisibleGuy

I cannot wait to see how this turns out.

I can't wait.

This is going to get ugly.

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## CloudMaker

> I cannot wait to see how this turns out.
> 
> I can't wait.
> 
> This is going to get ugly.



I can't wait either MAGA!!!  ::

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## InvisibleGuy

:freehug:

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## InvisibleGuy

(((hugs)))) to you

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## InvisibleGuy

Seriously, though.....

I hope your president leads this country, and I hope he keeps his promises..

Wait.

What were those promises??

Yeah.......

But I hope he lives up to be the president that we expect.

He has small hands. And we have small expectations.

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## InvisibleGuy

I hope he can live up to those expectations  ::):

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## InvisibleGuy

And I hope any woman that can live up to those expectations can be alright with the end result.

I'm sure you will, sweetie  ::):

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## CloudMaker

IDK what u are saying or what trumps hands have to do with this LOL

I have not been disappointed with Trump yet! #tiredofwinning

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## InvisibleGuy

> IDK what u are saying or what trumps hands have to do with this LOL



Of course you don't, sweetie.





> I have not been disappointed with Trump yet! #tiredofwinning



Of course you're happy with your president  ::):  I wouldn't expect you to reply any other way, CloudMaker.

You are stunningly predictable.

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## InvisibleGuy

#tiredoflamearguments

#tiredofdramamamas

#tiredofTrumpsupporterswhodonothaveafuqingclueasto  whatthey'retalkingaboutandwhotheysupport

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## CloudMaker

> #tiredoflamearguments
> 
> #tiredofdramamamas
> 
> #tiredofTrumpsupporterswhodonothaveafuqingclueasto  whatthey'retalkingaboutandwhotheysupport



When ever Trump does something stupid or evil........I stop and think.....what would our world be like now with 4 maybe 8 years of the absolute completely evil Clintons.
Trump has thrown a wrench in those plans for 4 years and maybe 8!   ::): 
I've never regretted voting for him for even a second.

 ::): 
He's a clown, but he's my clown.
 ::):   PRAISE KEK

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## InvisibleGuy

> When ever Trump does something stupid or evil........I stop and think.....what would our world be like now with 4 maybe 8 years of the absolute completely evil Clintons.
> Trump has thrown a wrench in those plans for 4 years and maybe 8!  
> I've never regretted voting for him for even a second.
> 
> 
> He's a clown, but he's my clown.
>   PRAISE KEK



Oh ffs.

Think about that for a second.

You just called him a clown, ffs.

What the actual fuq......

And you voted for him?? Dafuq??

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## InvisibleGuy

> When ever Trump does something stupid or evil......



Did....you really just post this? Seriously?

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## InvisibleGuy

You have got to be the world's biggest troll. I swear to god.

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## InvisibleGuy

It looks like Trump is back-pedaling now.

There are a whole, whole lot of people coming forward denouncing this. Even Obama, who has been very, very quiet since he left office, denounced this, as I'd totally expect him to.

Immigration reform is a very touchy subject here, as it is everywhere in the world it seems like lately and I have mixed feelings about some of it, tbh. I could fill up ten fucking pages in this thread about the impact immigration policies have on jobs, on healthcare, on taxes, I could fucking go on and on.

But these are kids. Donald Trump has really, really fucked himself this time, and not in a good way. This is like a PR nightmare, ffs. I don't know how you talk your way out of this, I really don't.

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## InvisibleGuy

"Deals are my art form. Other people paint or write poetry. I like making deals, preferably big deals. That's how I get my kicks".

Ffs.

@CloudMaker
 did you help Donald Trump write this press release, this tweet of this guy you call a hero?

Here's the link to Anderson Cooper's response to Trump and it is, imo, awesome. Brilliant.

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## InvisibleGuy

Please, please tell me you didn't help him write that response. Though. I wouldn't be surprised if you did, sweetie. Ffs.

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## InvisibleGuy

Look at the video. Look at 1 minute and 12 seconds in.

Do you see anyone back-peddling, anyone who sounds like he wants to take words back, anyone who sounds like he really can't read anything that isn't displayed on a teleprompter? Does it sound like anyone whose vocabulary includes words other than "HUUUGE" and "Wall" and "It's gonna be great"!!! And "DEALS"!

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## JamieWAgain

What I see on that video is a 'journalist ', a 'reporter of news' giving his own very biased opinion in a highly edited video. 
DACA has been his 'trump' card all along. He's bluffing. I'll give you the dreamers and you give me the wall. 

Frankly North Korea is my biggest concern today and it should be the world's biggest concern. Very frankly, I underestimated the North Koreans. I thought they were too stupid to successfully launch a missile. They're not. This mad man feeds his own family to the dogs. Literally. He dreams of killing us all.

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## InvisibleGuy

Well, of course it's a highly edited video and of course he has a biased opinion.

If it was just a news story reporting the facts then I probably wouldn't even have posted it. I mean....what is there to report, I think the facts are already out there lol.

And North Korea scares the hell out of me lately. Kim Jong-un is a fuqing psychopath. Of course, of course I'm concerned about our international relations with them, who wouldn't be.....

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## InvisibleGuy

I wouldn't even bother posting something from anyone right now that didn't have a biased opinion. Unless I was just trying to relay information and news.

This forum is sort of a way, imo, to bounce ideas off each other, to express your opinion and see what other people also think. Not just to relay information and news stories lol.

I mean, unless you just want to start controversy or conflict lol.

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## InvisibleGuy

I think it's obviously a really, really divisive issue and it gets people that ordinarily don't have much of an opinion on these kinds of issues...they start to have opinions and then it's a process to figure out how exactly you feel and where you stand and sometimes that can lead some people to even re-think their party affiliation, and what they believe. Imo. This is about kids, and where they're going to spend the rest of their lives, and if they're going to be torn apart from their families, ffs. I wouldn't want to be in any kind of situation to make those kinds of decisions but I wouldn't want to separate children from their parents like this.

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## InvisibleGuy

And then...there are always people who use these kinds of issues to create conflict. Imo. That's just from personal experience lmao......

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## CloudMaker

> "Deals are my art form. Other people paint or write poetry. I like making deals, preferably big deals. That's how I get my kicks".
> 
> Ffs.
> 
> @CloudMaker
>  did you help Donald Trump write this press release, this tweet of this guy you call a hero?
> 
> Here's the link to Anderson Cooper's response to Trump and it is, imo, awesome. Brilliant.



Yes i help trump write all his press releases didnt you know LOL!

Andersoon Cooper is so hot right now. Shame he's a BILDERBERG!!!

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## CloudMaker

Anderson cooper is the hotteest man on television IMO but he should stay out of politics!

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## Cuchculan

Something similar popped up in Irish law a few years back. If you arrived in Ireland, be it on a visit or to stay illegally, and had a kid, the kid was a citizen of this country. So was the parents. The problem? People were arriving pregnant on purpose. They knew exactly what they were doing. So the law was changed. You arrive pregnant and give birth here, means nothing these days. You are not a citizen just because of the birth. You still have to go through the whole system of becoming legal in the country. In other words it was a loophole in the law and it was been exploited. Big time. Granted of you are in a country so many years and they know about you, they should not be allowed to kick you out. Once you pass a certain point, years wise. If they don't want you in the country, they should make it quick. Not leave you in the country for years and then send you packing. Just get it over with as soon as you know you don't want them in the country.

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## InvisibleGuy

There's a lot of controversy among some people about the naturalization process here in the US. A lot of people come here just for the sole purpose of having children here like you said used to happen in Ireland and I understand why, but Idk that I agree with the policies we have, even though I really believe that dreamers should be allowed to stay, and of course, there is a huge, huge difference there. It costs tax payers hundreds of millions of dollars for healthcare and that's just in Texas alone. I'm not sure how I feel about NOT allowing children born here to become citizens through the naturalization process. It's a complicated issue imo, and it's not a black and white issue to me, there are a lot of issues to consider on both sides.

I don't think children who are born here, even if they're born here just for the sole purpose of becoming citizens, should be penalized. It's not their fault. I mean, imo, you'd be really heartless and cruel to think that kids should just be tossed aside like pieces of trash. But there are people in the US who think that way. I'm not sure what the answer is....if there was an easy answer then we'd have it already, of course, and imo the answer is not building some ridiculous fucking wall, that is an idea born out of a racist man (imo) who doesn't even want to search for real answers to a very, very complicated problem.

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## Cuchculan

The policies you have are in place for a reason. They would have to be voted out / changed in order for people to be allowed to stay. As it stands they are simply applying the law. Trump when he was running for the white house came out with all this ' Americans first ' stuff. That made it a ' Us against Them ' sort of thing. Them been everybody who is not legally in the US. That has always been his promise. I can well understand a person arriving in a country and having a kid five years later. Thus it was not planned. Thing with Ireland was they were arriving 8 months pregnant. It was all well planned out in advance. Not talking a few hundred either. They were arriving in their thousands from Africa. We couldn't handle the numbers arriving. Once they arrive in Ireland they only want to stay in Dublin. You put them elsewhere in the country and they moan about it. If they were fleeing wars and the likes would it really matter what part of Ireland you put them in? Some were put in a 5 star hotel in the West of the country and they said they hated the place. We had to do something to stop the vast numbers arriving in the country. But it had to be across the board. You couldn't just say ' Africans '. That would be racist. The did change the laws concerning children born in Ireland. That did put a stop to many flooding here. But we still get loads. They are passed onto to us. By right the first country they land in is the country that should stop them and process them. There are no direct flights between a lot of these African countries and Ireland. France is their first stop. The French are the ones passing them on. Putting them on planes to other countries. One other issue you run up against is the UN and human rights. We have heard that one so many times. The UN have their rules. You never know, they might tell Trump he is breaking human rights rules. Not that I think that he would care. Case of how many do you take in? Keep accepting them and they will keep on coming. Might sound like the right thing to do. Get ten thousand a month and suddenly it becomes a problem. Tax payer has to foot the bill over here too. Money has to come from somewhere. There is simply no more room in this country. That is not me been bad. That is me been honest. They are trying to sort out a major homeless crisis here in Ireland at the moment. We have people dying in the streets over night. Sleeping rough. If you take in more you will only add to that problem. Because there is nowhere to put them. That is the main issue. Lot of tent sites have popped up in various parts of Dublin. Until they sort that mess out they should no accept anybody else into the country. The UN wants them all in proper housing. We can't even house the Irish homeless. Might seem cruel to refuse them entry into the country. But it is been done with good reason. Maybe some day things will be sorted out.

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## InvisibleGuy

> The policies you have are in place for a reason. They would have to be voted out / changed in order for people to be allowed to stay. As it stands they are simply applying the law.



Well of course. But that doesn't mean the law is right. History will show you that in a lot of cases people broke the law to instigate change, change that brought civil rights to people of every race, change that allowed women to vote, change that gave more rights to children and minorities and...ffs, I could go on and on.

The fact that it's a law on the books does NOT, not, not make it necessarily right. Oh my god, I hope everyone understands that, if not then we are beyond help lol.

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## Cuchculan

If it doesn't male it right why not do away with the law? Must be a few people in your country who think the law is important to keep. Or else it would have been gone a long time ago. I am not saying it is right. What I am saying is that the law makers are the one leaving it there for some reason. I can only assume that reason is for them to be able to fall back on the law if needed. Say you have a person in your country that is not wanted there. They could apply that law on that one person. Thus meaning they are not doing anything illegal. If the law was to be removed / changed it could always be challenged by anybody they wanted to get rid of from your country. in other words it can be used selectively. Might have some hate preacher from the Middle East they want out of America. Because the law is there they can simply kick him out. He can't challenge it. Just my own opinion. All about how they use it and on whom they use it. Before Trump it might have been used more selectively. With Trump he wants to use it on everybody. Typical of the man.

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