# Outside the Box > Philosophy and Debate >  >  Mass Shooting in Connecticut

## WineKitty

I am sure I don't need to post any links regarding this--tons of stories all over the media and we all followed this story yesterday I am sure.

There has been much talk about gun control.  I wish I could be of the camp that thought by merely adding some legislation or banning certain types of weapons would stop the mass shootings that are seemingly on the rise.

Don't get me wrong--I am not a fan of guns really.  I do own a shot gun.  I think the gun show loopholes should be dealt with.  Everyone should undergo a background check.

But gun control wasn't the problem here.  The problems are multifaceted.  

What I don't hear anyone talking about is mental health and how we choose to ignore the need for people having easy access to services.  Rather we claim we cannot afford it...get insurance...it's everyone for themselves.  Even WITH insurance (and I have good insurance)  I have a limit of 20 counseling sessions per year with a copay.

This kid was one troubled and dangerously sick person.  Maybe the signs were there and were ignored and maybe not.  I don't know--the details of Adam Lanska are still quite minimal.  

But it seems to me that if we admit the failures in our society that are leading up to these events we might have a chance to prevent some of these tragedies.  Instead of waving our flag and proclaiming ourselves the best nation in the world (we aren't--no such thing) based on our military might, we need to focus on our clearly flawed society.  There are too many getting lost in the shuffle, too many poor kids that society doesn't care about, too many mentally ill going unchecked because they cannot get the help they need.  

There has been a fundamental shift in gun violence since somewhere around the 80s.  Mass shootings are on the rise and now have reached kindergarten classrooms.  When are we going to address the true roots of these issues rather than blame Obama, school security, gun control or whatever else.

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## T-Bone

Doesn't everyone who wants to purchase a gun already go through the process of a background check? Criminal anyways? Well i take that back, gunshow dealers have a reputation of not giving a damned. I suppose they could do away with those. I don't feel them to be a necessity anyways.
Anyways..do you suggest searching through everyone's medical records as well? I feel that would be a huge invasion of privacy. Some people even suggest a mental evaluation before anyone buys a gun, that would be total nonsense and have a high probability of error and wrongful discrimination.

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## CeCe

People need to be evaluated (phyical and mental) with a much longer wait processes before  being able to buy a gun.

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## WineKitty

Hmmm...not sure where I suggested going through people's medical records.  A background check consists of a criminal checkwhen it comes to guns..doesn't it?  And no... not everyone does get a background check.  I in no way suggest banning guns or think something as simple as more gun laws would stop mass shootings.  Again, I think the problems run far deeper than that.  I see the issue of people not getting help the need in a society that doesn't care about it's people enough to provide mental health care.  Our society puts health care and education last.  I think it's rather simplistic to say more gun control...armed teachers...metal detectors would have prevented the tragedy.  If it were only that simple.  Our priorities aren't about our people and caring for our society as a whole.  And as We let those priorities fall to last place our nation begins to implode from within.  The fall of America will cone not from a foreign enemy but from within.  And I believe it had already started.

A waiting period has nothing to do with this tragedy, though I am not in opposition of it...not sure how much it helps either.  Guns used were legally purchased.  We cannot ban and legislate our way into being safe.

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## WintersTale

The only thing that troubles me about the mentally sick being evaluated, is that I am mentally ill. And I also feel awkward about it. So I would be opening myself up to background checks, being questioned by police (and the police scare me), and feeling like I'm personally being targeted.

But, you know what? Even with a social anxiety disorder that I have, I would be willing to go through all that, if it would make the world a safer place.

If this 20 year old man had been questioned, before yesterday when he went crazy, maybe this would not have happened. Let's throw out the easy access to guns for a moment...we need to evaluate, why it is exactly, that mentally ill people are not being treated for their mental illnesses? Medications for bipolar and ADHD seem to be handed out like candy to kids who obviously aren't mentally sick and don't need them...why are they not being provided for the few who actually do need them?

I did some sick stuff when I was manic. I might have possibly committed a crime, if I hadn't gotten well. This kid might still be alive today, and be helping society instead of hurting it, like he did yesterday.

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## T-Bone

> *Hmmm...not sure where I suggested going through people's medical records.  A background check consists of a criminal checkwhen it comes to guns..doesn't it?  And no... not everyone does get a background check.*  I in no way suggest banning guns or think something as simple as more gun laws would stop mass shootings.  Again, I think the problems run far deeper than that.  *I see the issue of people not getting help the need in a society that doesn't care about it's people enough to provide mental health care.*  Our society puts health care and education last.  I think it's rather simplistic to say more gun control...armed teachers...metal detectors would have prevented the tragedy.  If it were only that simple.  Our priorities aren't about our people and caring for our society as a whole.  And as We let those priorities fall to last place our nation begins to implode from within.  The fall of America will cone not from a foreign enemy but from within.  And I believe it had already started.
> 
> A waiting period has nothing to do with this tragedy, though I am not in opposition of it...not sure how much it helps either.  Guns used were legally purchased.  We cannot ban and legislate our way into being safe.



I never said you did suggest getting into medical records. It was a question asking you for your opinion or for you to elaborate. 
As for mental health. Isn't that something one pretty much has to seek out on his/her own? What would you suggest, going to each home, asking if they had a gun and then offering mental health counseling?

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## WintersTale

> What would you suggest, going to each home, asking if they had a gun and then offering mental health counseling?



I wouldn't mind that. I have never tried to obtain a gun, either legally or illegally...have no reason to. And any mental health counseling that I can get would be wonderful, especially if the state pays for it.

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## T-Bone

> I wouldn't mind that. I have never tried to obtain a gun, either legally or illegally...have no reason to. And any mental health counseling that I can get would be wonderful, especially if the state pays for it.



LOL well hell i might not mind it either. But the point is, that would be extremely expensive if it were government/tax dollar paid, also unrealistic. Not to mention, if it were NOT free to the people being offered, they'd most likely reject it anyhow.

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## WintersTale

> LOL well hell i might not mind it either. But the point is, that would be extremely expensive if it were government/tax dollar paid, also unrealistic. Not to mention, if it were NOT free to the people being offered, they'd most likely reject it anyhow.



Which do you think the brother of the shooter would have preferred, as well as the Grandma:

A. That the shooter received mental health services, despite them paying for it, and 20 kids, as well as 6 other adults plus the shooter, would be alive today?
B. That everything transpired like it did yesterday?

Think carefully before you answer this question. It is NOT a trick question.

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## T-Bone

> Which do you think the brother of the shooter would have preferred, as well as the Grandma:
> 
> A. That the shooter received mental health services, despite them paying for it, and 20 kids, as well as 6 other adults plus the shooter, would be alive today?
> B. That everything transpired like it did yesterday?
> 
> Think carefully before you answer this question. It is NOT a trick question.



I'm sure they would have preferred option A. 
There are things to take into consideration though. The shooter was over 18 therefore he could have easily rejected mental health services if he showed no obvious signs of being disturbed. The second thing to take into consideration, obviously, is DID he show obvious signs of being mentally disturbed? Also, are the guns even registered to him...etc.

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## WineKitty

> I never said you did suggest getting into medical records. 
> As for mental health. Isn't that something one pretty much has to seek out on his/her own? What would you suggest, going to each home, asking if they had a gun and then offering mental health counseling?





I thought the standard background search meant for criminal/civil cases.  Not one's health records.  

Yes, seeking out counseling and such is self-initiated some times but as I stated in the OP, people cannot afford to get the care they need.  Again, I will point out in my own case I am allowed a mere 20 counseling sessions annually (co pay of 25) which is reasonable but for someone who needs to really work on somethings, 20 sessions can be used up in a hurry.  You are really taking what I am saying the wrong way, in that I am not suggesting going around on a witch hunt after anyone who needs counseling or mental health care but rather making those services readily available.  Also, as family members and/or friends, we can try to be vigilant but it is hard, almost impossible, to know when to intervene.  Being that this person was rather young, 20, it would seem he had some issues for some time and his own brother admitted they knew he had issues.  

My entire point is that I am not sure how yesterday's tragedy could have been prevented.  But, I do see that there is something going wrong with our society and that health care, mental health care needs, and education need to be a bigger priority in our country if we have any hope for our future.

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## Coffee

Morgan Freeman's statement about these shootings. I was with him up until the end. Gun control needs to be considered as much as mental health does. 





> "You want to know why. This may sound cynical, but here's why.
> 
> It's because of the way the media reports it. Flip on the news and watch how we treat the Batman theater shooter and the Oregon mall shooter like celebrities. Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris are household names, but do you know the name of a single victim of Columbine? Disturbed people who would otherwise just off themselves in their basements see the news and want to top it by doing something worse, and going out in a memorable way. Why a grade school? Why children? Because he'll be remembered as a horrible monster, instead of a sad nobody.
> 
> CNN's article says that if the body count "holds up", this will rank as the second deadliest shooting behind Virginia Tech, as if statistics somehow make one shooting worse than another. Then they post a video interview of third-graders for all the details of what they saw and heard while the shootings were happening. Fox News has plastered the killer's face on all their reports for hours. Any articles or news stories yet that focus on the victims and ignore the killer's identity? None that I've seen yet. Because they don't sell. So congratulations , sensationalist media, you've just lit the fire for someone to top this and knock off a day care center or a maternity ward next.
> 
> You can help by forgetting you ever read this man's name, and remembering the name of at least one victim. You can help by donating to mental health research instead of pointing to gun control as the problem."



On that note, here is a list of the victims: http://ktla.com/2012/12/15/medical-e...wtown-victims/

edit: wasn't Morgan Freeman who said it. I'm not sure who did.

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## WintersTale

I agree with everything that Morgan Freeman said in that statement.

And what is sad is people aren't going to listen to him. You know what my sister said? "They will try to rationalize, diagnose, and explain it all away, when it all boils down to one guy, who was sick in the head."

That is very true. We can point fingers at loners, Aspies, socially anxious people, whatever. There are people who are in those categories who are not violent at all. We can point fingers at horror films. I love horror films, and I don't like violence or blood in real life (I would probably pass out at a crime scene.) You can point fingers at video games or music, that is just as stupid as blaming horror films.

Let's point the finger at where it belongs: the guy who was severely mentally disturbed, didn't get help, and took his mother's weapons and used it to commit mass murder. It is nobody else's fault but his, and it was society's wrongdoing that we didn't discover it until _after_ he snapped.

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## Denise

^ Amen. It's that simple. but humans love Complicated

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## Coffee

Yeah but the problem is that if we look at each of these as isolated incidents, we can't do anything about it. So we like to find patterns. We collect our data and propose theories and solutions that never really come to pass, but it makes us feel better to apply logic to a totally illogical situation. 

I agree that we can't truly blame anyone but the shooter himself, but it is important to try to understand what happened so that we can try to reduce the possibility of it happening again. That probably won't work because there will always be crazy people in the world, but it's better than nothing, I guess.

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## WintersTale

What needs to be understood is, you don't prevent something by adding more of the same.

I've heard many different things. That school shootings are part of a vengeful God, who hates that we took the bible out of our schools. That if the kids had been armed with guns, the shooter would have been killed before he killed all those kids. Etc.

What _doesn't_ make sense is the idea that a 5 or 6 year old would A.) be mentally capable of taking down a 20 year old college student, and B.) be physically capable of taking down a 20 year old college student. Nevermind the argument that some of the fatalities would have been attributed to kids killing kids by accident, or the shooter using kids as a shield. No matter how geeky this guy was, he still was much more powerful than the kids. 

This sicko probably targeted kids, because he knew he couldn't overpower college students. He hated himself, and others, and wanted to show the world how much he hated it. It's just another Columbine, although twisted, because he went after 6 year olds instead of 16 year olds. 

Either way, pray for the victims, don't shed a tear for the killer. He doesn't deserve it.

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## Ironman

> Morgan Freeman's statement about these shootings. I was with him up until the end. Gun control needs to be considered as much as mental health does. 
> 
> 
> 
> On that note, here is a list of the victims: http://ktla.com/2012/12/15/medical-e...wtown-victims/







> I agree with everything that Morgan Freeman said in that statement.
> 
> And what is sad is people aren't going to listen to him. You know what my sister said? "They will try to rationalize, diagnose, and explain it all away, when it all boils down to one guy, who was sick in the head."
> 
> That is very true. We can point fingers at loners, Aspies, socially anxious people, whatever. There are people who are in those categories who are not violent at all. We can point fingers at horror films. I love horror films, and I don't like violence or blood in real life (I would probably pass out at a crime scene.) You can point fingers at video games or music, that is just as stupid as blaming horror films.
> 
> Let's point the finger at where it belongs: the guy who was severely mentally disturbed, didn't get help, and took his mother's weapons and used it to commit mass murder. It is nobody else's fault but his, and it was society's wrongdoing that we didn't discover it until _after_ he snapped.



Even the father of one of the victims said the same thing.  We all have the Second Amendment.  What we choose to do with that is key.  The suspect chose to use it for evil.  It is a given right to everyone.  WE must have the knowledge of right from wrong - to use our rights in the correct way.  The suspect chose to commit a crime with his right - and he paid the ultimate price....with his life, and quite possibly, his soul.

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## WintersTale

> We all have the Second Amendment.  What we choose to do with that is key.



They need to do away with the 2nd Amendment. It's outdated.

When that part of the Constitution was written, America was at war with Britain. I am not really knowledgeable about American history, but I do know that people had to fear being shot by people who trespassed on their property. For that reason, the right to bear arms was included.

People also hunted their own food at that time. There were no stores. Krogers didn't exist. Neither did Walmart. There is no probable reason for someone to go hunting anymore for their own food, unless they enjoy killing.

And in this age, where we have locked doors, alarm systems, and police officers at the call of a button, why do we need to bear arms? Let the police carry guns, let the criminals carry guns, let the police deal with the criminals, and let everyone else who isn't a criminal not be able to access them. The whole reason this kid was able to get guns in the first place was because his mother was a gun enthusiast. If she hadn't believed in the 2nd Amendment, we wouldn't even be having this debate.

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## WineKitty

http://news.msn.com/us/police-2-dead...ocid=ansnews11

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2012...-causing-panic

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/1...n_2307505.html

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories...MPLATE=DEFAULT

ALL THIS just since the Connecticut shooting.    The second amendment isn't holy doctrine and can be revised to fit modern times.  Again, I SUPPORT PEOPLE HAVING GUNS and DO NOT WANT TO TAKE PEOPLE'S GUNS AWAY.  But what is amazing to me is people are so in love with their guns that it's blinding them to the FACT that America has a  big problem on it's hands.  I don't see the issue as a simple one that only gun control is going to solve.  It runs so much more deeper than that.  Again, I think we need to take a hard look at our priorities in America and start giving a crap about our citizens, our fellow countrymen.  Health care -- and that means whole care for the mind as well--must be available to all regardless of how much money one has.  Education needs to be a priority.  These are things that made us a strong country in the first place.

BUT----When the second amendment was ratified in* 1791* single shot guns loaded through the muzzle were the weapon of choice.  I don't think the founding fathers were talking about semiautomatic weapons being used to mow down kindergarteners.  Laws must be changed and updated to fit the times.  It drives me crazy when people think that talking about gun control means taking away their precious guns.  I support only a few changes that apparently most NRA members support also, such as background checks (criminal that is) which 74% of NRA members support as well.  So what is the problems with instating that?  

http://www.mayorsagainstillegalguns....pr006-12.shtml

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## T-Bone

> They need to do away with the 2nd Amendment. It's outdated.
> 
> When that part of the Constitution was written, America was at war with Britain. I am not really knowledgeable about American history, but I do know that people had to fear being shot by people who trespassed on their property. For that reason, the right to bear arms was included.
> 
> People also hunted their own food at that time. There were no stores. Krogers didn't exist. Neither did Walmart. There is no probable reason for someone to go hunting anymore for their own food, unless they enjoy killing.
> 
> And in this age, where we have locked doors, alarm systems, and police officers at the call of a button, why do we need to bear arms? Let the police carry guns, let the criminals carry guns, let the police deal with the criminals, and let everyone else who isn't a criminal not be able to access them. The whole reason this kid was able to get guns in the first place was because his mother was a gun enthusiast. If she hadn't believed in the 2nd Amendment, we wouldn't even be having this debate.



How does one then defend themselves against someone with a gun? Police response time is terrible. You could be shot dead by an armed intruder by the time they arrive. 
Your theory on hunting is pretty goofy i think. Thinking people must be forced to buy overpriced meat at grocery store, or else they just like killing things. ::  
I keep hearing crazier and crazier things in these gun control debates. I'm pretty scared for where this country is headed. I really am.

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## WineKitty

Personally, I could never support an outright gun "ban".  But I fail to see why the AWB was ever lifted.  However, now I don't see how it can ever be reinstated with all the guns that have been put out there since.  

And i am not against hunting--all meat comes from dead animals.  I know a goodly amount of hunters that take pride in their accuracy, and use the meat of their kill.  They stock their freezers with venison and elk.  

I am for closing the gunshow loopholes though and again, support criminal background checks.  You cannot get certain jobs if you are a felon, so it's not out of line to say you cannot get a gun.  Even people on the no-fly list can get a gun which I just found out and found to be odd?  

I can see how having a gun readily available makes some feel better but I am just not into them.  I have a gun but I do not sleep with it under my pillow as some seem to.  But a handgun can do plenty of damage.  Why does someone need a semiautomatic rifle that pumps out 30 rounds for "home protection"?

Again, I dont support a gun ban and feel the problem is very multifaceted.  I am amazed at how many memes I am seeing on FaceBook, esp the one that shows various semiautomatic weapons and says "WHATEVER IT TAKES" in a pro gun stance.  Nice. :: 

Sidenote:  Why are certain words in my post links???  Why does it do that?





> How does one then defend themselves against someone with a gun? Police response time is terrible. You could be shot dead by an armed intruder by the time they arrive. 
> Your theory on hunting is pretty goofy i think. Thinking people must be forced to buy overpriced meat at grocery store, or else they just like killing things. 
> I keep hearing crazier and crazier things in these gun control debates. I'm pretty scared for where this country is headed. I really am.




When I hover over the word grocery in your post it pops up an ad for Tide.  That is not my brand and stop pushing your hidden laundry detergent agenda!!! :-D ::  :Tongue:  ::

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## WintersTale

That's odd, WineKitty. I don't see anything like that here.

The media are pushing an anti-mental illness agenda at the moment. It makes me paranoid, because I am not doing anything wrong, but I feel like I'm a terrible person for trying to get well.

I think banning assault weapons is a first step, and is needed. I mean, what point do people have, having them? It really does not belong in the family home!

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## T-Bone

> I am for closing the gunshow loopholes though and again, support criminal background checks.  You cannot get certain jobs if you are a felon, so it's not out of line to say you cannot get a gun.  Even people on the no-fly list can get a gun which I just found out and found to be odd?  
> 
> I can see how having a gun readily available makes some feel better but I am just not into them.  I have a gun but I do not sleep with it under my pillow as some seem to.  But a handgun can do plenty of damage.  Why does someone need a* semiautomatic rifle that pumps out 30 rounds for "home protection"?*



Gun ownership laws need to be revised for felons actually. Non violent felons such as myself should not be restricted from owning firearms. Some assaults aren't even felonies, but then there's me...a huge threat to the public with my little 20 dollar bag of dope. Better make sure no gun ever gets in my hands huh? 

But anyways a question for you, if you can have a semi automatic handgun with the same capacity for home defense why the hell does it really matter if it's a rifle or not?

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## Ironman

> http://news.msn.com/us/police-2-dead...ocid=ansnews11
> 
> http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2012...-causing-panic
> 
> http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/1...n_2307505.html
> 
> http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories...MPLATE=DEFAULT
> 
> ALL THIS just since the Connecticut shooting.    The second amendment isn't holy doctrine and can be revised to fit modern times.  Again, I SUPPORT PEOPLE HAVING GUNS and DO NOT WANT TO TAKE PEOPLE'S GUNS AWAY.  But what is amazing to me is people are so in love with their guns that it's blinding them to the FACT that America has a  big problem on it's hands.  I don't see the issue as a simple one that only gun control is going to solve.  It runs so much more deeper than that.  Again, I think we need to take a hard look at our priorities in America and start giving a crap about our citizens, our fellow countrymen.  Health care -- and that means whole care for the mind as well--must be available to all regardless of how much money one has.  Education needs to be a priority.  These are things that made us a strong country in the first place.
> ...



Just to add to the hysteria, there were three stories on my local news about people making comments on Twitter that were perceived as threats.  A couple, if not all, the twits were ARRESTED and had to go to court!

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## WintersTale

> Just to add to the hysteria, there were three stories on my local news about people making comments on Twitter that were perceived as threats.  A couple, if not all, the twits were ARRESTED and had to go to court!



I don't understand people that use Twitter for evil purposes. It's supposed to be fun, people! Not for sick stuff.

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## JesusChild

My heart since it happened has been heavy with Sadness, I have cried and prayed for all the victims, their families and the entire Newton Community, I have watched CNN here and there, You can really see the impact this has had on the nation not just the nation but here in Canada. 

Teachers who are striking right now want to wear black arm bands but not every parent is comfortable with the idea and I understand where they are coming from, they have a right to decide when and where they will tell their child about this.  I see how upset it gets people like Piers Morgan and others who are absolutely enraged.  

I've seen reports about the different kinds of psychiatric drugs all these mass shooters took and how it might contribute, I don't have it on me but you can look it up, probably really strong psychiatric drugs you'd probably know the names better than me. Sadly there will always be people who will live in Denial and pretend that these shootings were nothing more than some mentally I'll person with a gun and go back to their normal lives.

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## WineKitty

> Just to add to the hysteria, there were three stories on my local news about people making comments on Twitter that were perceived as threats.  A couple, if not all, the twits were ARRESTED and had to go to court!




Two people shot and killed, albeit a crime of passion apparently, in a crowded popular Las Vegas casino lobby.

Fashion Island in Newport Beach is an extremely busy mall in a densely populated area that was busy with Christmas shoppers.  Someone unloading 50 rounds in the parking lot most likely did create some panic and hysteria.  Rightfully so.

The shooting at the Alabama hospital ended up in the death of the shooter and three people being shot. 

I think it's horrible that this is going on.  But an average of 87 people a day dying from gun violence isn't bad.  I wonder what the number is for ALL violent crimes?  That would be interesting to know.





> Gun ownership laws need to be revised for felons actually. Non violent felons such as myself should not be restricted from owning firearms. Some assaults aren't even felonies, but then there's me...a huge threat to the public with my little 20 dollar bag of dope. Better make sure no gun ever gets in my hands huh? 
> 
> But anyways a question for you, if you can have a semi automatic handgun with the same capacity for home defense why the hell does it really matter if it's a rifle or not?



Hmm.  Well, you did make a few good points.  I would have to agree that the felon thing should be for violent offenders, not non violent.  I would change my remark on that.

I am not sure semi automatic handguns or rifles are really necessary are they?  Shows my ignorance on guns a bit.  I freely admit I am not a gun expert.  But I don't have to be to know that a gun that sprays bullets at a quick succession isn't all that necessary for home protection.  In most home protection situations aren't a very minimal amount of rounds fired....not 30? 

But that said, the genie is out of the bottle.  Too many out there to "ban" them.  I  dont support a ban for the simple reason it wouldn't work.

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## T-Bone

> When I hover over the word grocery in your post it pops up an ad for Tide.  That is not my brand and stop pushing your hidden laundry detergent agenda!!! :-D



Don't have any ads popping up here. What the hell browser do you use? Did you edit my post or something to say "this person is on your ignore list"? You trying to play some trick on me lol?





> In most home protection situations aren't a very minimal amount of rounds fired....not 30?



The more the better i would say. You don't wanna have one bullet, miss the shot, and then be murdered do ya?

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## JesusChild

> I don't understand people that use Twitter for evil purposes. It's supposed to be fun, people! Not for sick stuff.



 Somebody on Twitter made a twitter page called @BlastinKids saying that his name was Adam Lanza and he was reported to the FBI twitter page about his posts which were absolutely appalling it was basically one big joke to him it was sick and those people have done the same thing made light of this horrific event that has shattered and changed so many lives.

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## T-Bone

> Somebody on Twitter made a twitter page called @BlastinKids saying that his name was Adam Lanza and he was reported to the FBI twitter page about his posts which were absolutely appalling it was basically one big joke to him it was sick and those people have done the same thing made light of this horrific event that has shattered and changed so many lives.



Probably just some young kid being a punk. Can't expect some people to be mature about things. Not something i'd worry about. Doesn't even sound worthy of reporting to the FBI. I mean why report this knowing the Adam Lanza is already dead? Just because his twitters were mocking the situation? I'd hope the FBI have bigger fish to fry.

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## WintersTale

> Somebody on Twitter made a twitter page called @BlastinKids saying that his name was Adam Lanza and he was reported to the FBI twitter page about his posts which were absolutely appalling it was basically one big joke to him it was sick and those people have done the same thing made light of this horrific event that has shattered and changed so many lives.



That is so sick. 

People are so ready to blame violent video games, goth music, horror movies, or violence in mainstream media. They forget that, not everyone, not even those who are mentally ill, like violence in real life.

I wish more people were like Martin Luther King and Gandhi. I'm so tired of being typecasted because I'm different, yet everyone is so willing to thrust out these people who are troubled, into the media. It's like they feed on it. I have a healthy interest in Adam Lanza, because I want to know what went wrong...but I do know it's NOT because he was autistic, socially awkward, socially phobic, a computer geek, thin, or a loner!

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## JesusChild

I absolutely agree with you I too feel that more people should be like Martin Luther King and Gandhi. I hear you about being typecasted I was talking to my mom about this tonight, about how when theirs a shooting the media talks about how the person was a loner, was this and that. 

I like your sig by the way, I completely agree with the points you made. I completely understand your need to want to know why this guy did what he did,  What ever reason he had it will have ultimately have gone to the grave with him. He or Twitter took down his page cause it's no longer there. I just think its horrible to me making a mockery out of the situation and saying that you would love to shoot those kids etc; I'm with you in what you said Winter Tale.

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## Anteros

> Sidenote:  Why are certain words in my post links???  Why does it do that?
> 
> When I hover over the word grocery in your post it pops up an ad for Tide.  That is not my brand and stop pushing your hidden laundry detergent agenda!!! :-D



You might want to run a malware scan.  I had a similar thing happen a couple of weeks ago, and it turned out to be a nasty trojan. 

I don't think you were infected by the board.  I'll let our web developer know, though.

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## WineKitty

I am running Malwarebytes right now.  I thought it was just this forum but it happens on another one also.  Certain key words show up as links to products.  > ::(: 

It was some damn thing called "Coupon Companion" and now no links are there.  I guess my theory on GoatHorned's laundry detergent agenda might have been flawed... ;b  ::D:

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## JesusChild

> I am running Malwarebytes right now.  I thought it was just this forum but it happens on another one also.  Certain key words show up as links to products.  >



 A Great Program to run and one that I use is Microsoft Security Essentials, I really hope I don't run into problems too. Yeah I'm sorry that's happening to you.

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## Ironman

> They need to do away with the 2nd Amendment. It's outdated.
> 
> When that part of the Constitution was written, America was at war with Britain. I am not really knowledgeable about American history, but I do know that people had to fear being shot by people who trespassed on their property. For that reason, the right to bear arms was included.
> 
> People also hunted their own food at that time. There were no stores. Krogers didn't exist. Neither did Walmart. There is no probable reason for someone to go hunting anymore for their own food, unless they enjoy killing.
> 
> And in this age, where we have locked doors, alarm systems, and police officers at the call of a button, why do we need to bear arms? Let the police carry guns, let the criminals carry guns, let the police deal with the criminals, and let everyone else who isn't a criminal not be able to access them. The whole reason this kid was able to get guns in the first place was because his mother was a gun enthusiast. If she hadn't believed in the 2nd Amendment, we wouldn't even be having this debate.




Actually, another point of the Second Amendment was also for the People's protection against tyranny and foreign powers......as in militias, which can be used for our Defense in times of crisis.

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## JesusChild

You want to know what they have now? Bullet Proof Backpacks, they showed them on the news tonight. Bullet Proof backpacks you have got to be kidding me? I find that absolutely ridiculous, personally I find it laughable that kids are going to school with a backpack and an 11 year old Utah boy bought a gun into school saying that his parents wanted him to have it. 

A claim his parents are denying and now reports are, he waved it in front of other students. I don't know if his parents are telling the truth or not but it is their responsibility as parents to lock up their guns and say to their child you are not to play around with this that it's a right and we don't think its acceptable or what ever other talk they have with him. What ever the circumstances there is no way the Principal would have made exceptions for him or anyone else to walk into the school with a gun. 

I actually agree with Winter tale in all honesty, I really wish more people adopted the principals of Gandhi and Martin Luther King Junior and that yes schools that don't already have strong security should get them. Camera's, Secure doors that set an alarm after 9 and an intercom system. Kids shouldn't have to go to school terrified they might get killed. 

Kids in Israel, Palestine, Somalia, the Congo, Pakistan, etc face that everyday they too shouldn't have to face that but here in North America in a Democracy in a place that should value human rights people put Guns over children I personally think Children are more valuable than guns.

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## barefootbeauty

My heart breaks everytime I read something about the Sandy Hook tragedy and the same question keeps running through my mind.. Why is nothing being done about the gun laws there?  It is awful when you realize that if you wanted a semi automatic you could probably go to your local Walmart (if in the  US) and purchase one.  
I have read statistics that say that China 5 school shootings in the last 2 years and has like 5 times the population as the US which has had 15... Keep in mind China has very strict if not a complete ban on guns.    So please explain to me why after 15 shootings are these firearms reaching the hands of irresponsible headcases?  If you want to own a gun for hobby purposes such as hunting or whatever they should only be made available to people who OWN a GUN LICENCE and during the hunting season..  any other time they should be locked away by officials or the government.
As for the 2nd Amendment stuff:  "We need guns to stop invaders"... besides 9/11 when are you planning on getting invaded?   "We need to protect our homes and family"... Its called an alarm system... other countries use them and don't rely on guns or weapons....  

I hope no other children have to be put through this hell, the country has been through enough having 20 kids + 6 adults being lost due to guns.

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## WintersTale

They need to ban guns here. They just really need to.

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## T-Bone

> They need to ban guns here. They just really need to.



I really hope your wish never comes true. That would be the worst thing to ever happen to this country.

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## WintersTale

> I really hope your wish never comes true. That would be the worst thing to ever happen to this country.



As opposed to people getting shot in the streets, everyday?

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## T-Bone

> As opposed to people getting shot in the streets, everyday?



 Hell i've never been shot once, yet alone everyday. Considering the vast majority of people never will be shot, i'd definitely say it's worse, yes. 
The gun BAN you want would result in a huge loss of life. Why would you want that?

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## WintersTale

> Hell i've never been shot once, yet alone everyday. Considering the vast majority of people never will be shot, i'd definitely say it's worse, yes. 
> The gun BAN you want would result in a huge loss of life. Why would you want that?



I don't see it resulting it anything like that.

If anything, it would save lives. It would just result in people who are gun enthusiasts not being able to access guns.

And can someone explain to me how, in other parts of the world, where guns are banned, or at least aren't obsessed like over here, school shootings don't happen every year, much less every day?

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## T-Bone

> I don't see it resulting it anything like that.
> 
> If anything, it would save lives. It would just result in people who are gun enthusiasts not being able to access guns.
> 
> And can someone explain to me how, in other parts of the world, where guns are banned, or at least aren't obsessed like over here, school shootings don't happen every year, much less every day?



I believe there would be an extremely violent revolt. People would definitely have the right to be angry too.

Why are you totally exaggerating the frequency of school shootings? Being deceitful is not a good way to prove a point, imo.

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## WintersTale

*sigh*

I once watched a horror movie that started off with "Every day, 12 people just disappear. Some are found. Some aren't."

I don't know how true that is, but they cited a news source underneath. Probably fictional, but anything to reduce the violence, in any way possible, should be done.

I am all for fantasy horror, but the true monsters need to be prevented from doing damage. If Freddy Kreuger was on the streets, I'd say that we needed to lock him up.

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## WineKitty

As I have stated, I don't advocate a "ban" per se.  But I don't think it's unreasonable to talk about additional gun control measures.  Sadly, if you mention those two words--gun control--the gun nuts perceive that as "gun ban".  I was talking to someone about this the other day who couldn't grasp the difference between the two terms.  

Our society is coming apart slowly.  America is it's own worst enemy.  We need to worry more about our fellow countrymen than weaponry.  I know I said this before but it's so obvious to me that it's hard to believe everyone cannot see that.

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## AussiePea

You only need to look at what effect the gun "ban" imposed here after our horrific 1996 massacre has had on the overall rate of shootings, murder and suicide to see that quite honestly, banning them in the states would not really achieve anything.  Crime involving guns here was not reduced and something like 90% of all gun related crime was with unregistered and illegally owned weaponry.  Suicide rates actually increased, eventhough suicide with guns reduced 80% (they just used other means).  So with that in mind I can't really see how a ban there would  make any real difference, there are just SO MANY guns and those who would ever intend on using them illegally would simply keep them or find a way to keep access to them.

Regulating them can't be a bad idea if for no other reason than educating the population in some fashion and hopefully reducing the number in rotation 100 years down the line, but as far as a means of preventing massacres and general gun related crime, I really don't see how anything could help your country, it has almost become part of your culture.  Sad.

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