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Thread: Placebos?

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    Otherside's Avatar
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    Placebos?

    So this is probably in the wrong section, but I couldn't think where to put this.

    So I was watching a documentary earlier, claiming to be testing a drug that "eradicated all fear" and had previously only be used in the military on soilders which would cause them to act without any sort of fear for there own lives. The drug-"Rumyidon" - was being released to the public for the first time. Four people were testing the drug out-two with crippling fear of heights, a woman who had bad stage fright, and a man with SA.

    The drug had pretty much instantaneous effects. All four of them began to expierence the side effects almost immediately, one of them was able to look down from a height without fear pretty much immediately. The man with SA was, after one dose of the Rumiydon drug, able to step into a confrontation between a cameraman and a passer by who got angry with them (he was a journalism student at university.)

    The drug was fake. Everything from the pharmaceutical labourites to the color of the medicine themselves was designed to give an air of authenticity and a calming effect. Everything that was said was was said with the intention of reinforcing the idea that Rumyidon would work. At the end of the two part show (with all four of the people having had a "successful" outcome after taking Rumyidon) it was revealed to them that they had been taking a placebo that contained nothing more than sugar and had no chemical effect on the body.

    So Im curious as to what you guys think of this. I take Propranolol for anxiety and have done for several months now. But if part of the success of my meds is just the placebo effect? I'm not sure what to think of this.

    At the same time, this programme was hosted by Derren Brown. Don't think he's well known outside of the UK, but maybe...and I'm generally skeptical of things like this anyway, I don't generall start to believe hem before I've looked into them more.

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    metamorphosis's Avatar
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    Do you a link to the program?
    Some people will always respond to something that is claimed to be a medication. Even though it is just a sugar pill. Thats why double or triple blind studies are important and necessary for medication testing before the drug becomes cleared to hit the market! Even after release docs/pdocs and patients often find that certain meds. also work off label for other treatments, ie. anti-convulsants for anxiety disorders.

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    IllusionOfHappiness's Avatar killer of conversations
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    I wish my benzos worked that way. Wouldn't have to worry about tolerance!

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    Antidote's Avatar Rude & Shouty
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    Some people are prone to placebos. I don't think I am, if anything I'm prone to nocebos since I'm always concerned that nothing will work. I also take beta blockers and they are the only thing that without fail, stop me from having panic attacks in social situations. They work by directly blocking the beta adrenergic receptors on the heart and elsewhere. So I don't believe one can get a placebo from that unless they took a very small, and ineffective dose but were convinced it was working. Sometimes I see people on only 10 mg saying it worked and wonder if they're getting a placebo, because I need 4 times or more that amount to do anything, and I'm quite a light weight female.

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    Quote IllusionOfHappiness View Post
    I wish my benzos worked that way. Wouldn't have to worry about tolerance!
    Come to think of it, me too! My klonopin could just be a placebo mint

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    Quote metamorphosis View Post
    Do you a link to the program?
    Some people will always respond to something that is claimed to be a medication. Even though it is just a sugar pill. Thats why double or triple blind studies are important and necessary for medication testing before the drug becomes cleared to hit the market! Even after release docs/pdocs and patients often find that certain meds. also work off label for other treatments, ie. anti-convulsants for anxiety disorders.
    http://www.channel4.com/programmes/d...e-specials/4od

    You can try it, but I get the feeling it'll only work in the UK. Also, I'm not putting much stock in the program, the results just interested me.

    I know doctors use drugs off label to treat other things that there not licensed for. My beta-blockers, for example, slow down the heart rate and are used as blood-pressure pills. The packet says that it's okay to use it for treating anxiety, but whilst in America over the summer, a pharmacist seemed shocked when I mentioned to him I was using Propranolol to treat anxiety. Which was kinda odd becauase I'm sure I've come across others from the Us who are on that med for anxiety.

    Quote Antidote View Post
    Some people are prone to placebos. I don't think I am, if anything I'm prone to nocebos since I'm always concerned that nothing will work. I also take beta blockers and they are the only thing that without fail, stop me from having panic attacks in social situations. They work by directly blocking the beta adrenergic receptors on the heart and elsewhere. So I don't believe one can get a placebo from that unless they took a very small, and ineffective dose but were convinced it was working. Sometimes I see people on only 10 mg saying it worked and wonder if they're getting a placebo, because I need 4 times or more that amount to do anything, and I'm quite a light weight female.
    10mg worked as a placebo for me for about the first two weeks of me using it. I was mega confident pretty much immeadiatley, but then it faded, and I went back to my same anxious self. I'm kinda a lightweight female too, and I'm on 40mg three times a day at the momment, which is the only dosage that's started to do something that's lasted two weeks.

    Yeah, I think more people are prone to placebo's than others. I am a bit, I guess...but the effects just don't last.

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    Quote Otherside View Post
    http://www.channel4.com/programmes/d...e-specials/4od

    You can try it, but I get the feeling it'll only work in the UK. Also, I'm not putting much stock in the program, the results just interested me.

    I know doctors use drugs off label to treat other things that there not licensed for. My beta-blockers, for example, slow down the heart rate and are used as blood-pressure pills. The packet says that it's okay to use it for treating anxiety, but whilst in America over the summer, a pharmacist seemed shocked when I mentioned to him I was using Propranolol to treat anxiety. Which was kinda odd becauase I'm sure I've come across others from the Us who are on that med for anxiety.



    10mg worked as a placebo for me for about the first two weeks of me using it. I was mega confident pretty much immeadiatley, but then it faded, and I went back to my same anxious self. I'm kinda a lightweight female too, and I'm on 40mg three times a day at the momment, which is the only dosage that's started to do something that's lasted two weeks.

    Yeah, I think more people are prone to placebo's than others. I am a bit, I guess...but the effects just don't last.
    True a lot of people here are scripted beta-blockers not only for hypertension but also for anxiety. Pregabalin (Lyrica) and gabapentin are both another example. They are in the anti-convulsant class. Both are also used for fibromyalgia and as an anxiolytic.
    Maybe just a U.K. thing , I've always wanted to visit Britain and check out a United Manchester match!!!

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    The shows looked very interesting. But it said "sorry not available in your area" so I couldn't watch them.

    I believe I would qualify as being easily influenced by a placebo. Back when i took a few drugs, they seem to work for a short time like 6 weeks. Then when they don't, they raised the dose. Still nothing. etc. I believe if it truly is a placebo-effect, or a real placebo pill, the benefits won't continue. So if you keep using it and keep benefitting, that's great! Unless you are paying a lot of $ for a sugar pill, that would suck and somebody should be sued.

    It would be interesting to see if a person could become addicted to a fake benzo, and even after they were told it was just a placebo, would they still go thru withdrawal? I could see myself doing that....and then strangling them for tricking me, lol.

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