Random Thought of the Day

[Nyctophilia]

Lol people complaining that Karen is a racial slur. If it was I'd probably be offended. I'm offended by slurs that I feel target me and I'm pretty sensitive. I find 'theyfab' very annoying. (Well I'm gradually reclaiming it but not there yet.)

In this case it's more about behaviour/attitude and class though.

Matt Walsh:

"Karen" is a racial slur. If I derisively referred to random black women I find annoying as "Shaniqua" or whatever everyone would consider it racist. The Karen slur is used to dismiss and degrade white women. That?s the whole point.

I mean I would be more concerned about your fans responding to your tweet who agree with the below message (cause I see it more and more,) but that's just me I guess. This only matters cause it's WHITE. Any other context and he's telling women to take up less space haha.

Well white women are the cause of the majority of this nation's problems.
#RepealThe19th

Anyway as someone else pointed out:



Why does Matt care though? (And he really does someone took a bunch of screenshots of him bringing this up over the past 2 years and there have been many.) He's not big on the white women who are often left wing after all. And to be a racial slur it would have to be predominantly used by non-white people on white people but that's not really how it's used the behaviour and class trumps the race and gender connection so it's not exclusive though there is a pattern/trend and tons of white people use it (including women):



So is it a slur against white people (a race,) or "white people"

https://slatestarcodex.com/2014/09/3...-the-outgroup/

(this is the blog post I mentioned before in another post when I brought up Scott Alexander. It is very useful haha. Though it's been a little while since I quoted from it.)

I CAN TOLERATE ANYTHING EXCEPT THE OUTGROUP

Let's start by asking what exactly an outgroup is.

There's a very boring sense in which, assuming the Emperor’s straight, gays are part of his "outgroup" ie a group that he is not a member of. But if the Emperor has curly hair, are straight-haired people part of his outgroup? If the Emperor's name starts with the letter 'A', are people whose names start with the letter 'B' part of his outgroup?

Nah. I would differentiate between multiple different meanings of outgroup, where one is "a group you are not a part of" and the other is…something stronger.

I want to avoid a very easy trap, which is saying that outgroups are about how different you are, or how hostile you are. I don’t think that’s quite right.

Compare the Nazis to the German Jews and to the Japanese. The Nazis were very similar to the German Jews: they looked the same, spoke the same language, came from a similar culture. The Nazis were totally different from the Japanese: different race, different language, vast cultural gap. But the Nazis and Japanese mostly got along pretty well. Heck, the Nazis were actually moderately positively disposed to the Chinese, even when they were technically at war. Meanwhile, the conflict between the Nazis and the German Jews - some of whom didn’t even realize they were anything other than German until they checked their grandparents' birth certificate - is the stuff of history and nightmares. Any theory of outgroupishness that naively assumes the Nazis' natural outgroup is Japanese or Chinese people will be totally inadequate.

And this isn’t a weird exception. Freud spoke of the narcissism of small differences, saying that "it is precisely communities with adjoining territories, and related to each other in other ways as well, who are engaged in constant feuds and ridiculing each other". Nazis and German Jews. Northern Irish Protestants and Northern Irish Catholics. Hutus and Tutsis. South African whites and South African blacks. Israeli Jews and Israeli Arabs. Anyone in the former Yugoslavia and anyone else in the former Yugoslavia.

[...]

In other words, outgroups may be the people who look exactly like you, and scary foreigner types can become the in-group on a moment’s notice when it seems convenient.

And my hypothesis, stated plainly, is that if you’re part of the Blue Tribe, then your outgroup isn't al-Qaeda, or Muslims, or blacks, or gays, or transpeople, or Jews, or atheists – it's the Red Tribe.

And on a hunch I checked the author photos, and every single one of these articles was written by a white person.

White People Are Ruining America? White. White People Are Still A Disgrace? White. White Guys: We Suck And We're Sorry? White. Bye Bye, Whiny White Dudes? White. Dear Entitled Straight White Dudes, I'm Evicting You From My Life? White. White Dudes Need To Stop Whitesplaining? White. Reasons Why Americans Suck #1: White People? White.

We've all seen articles and comments and articles like this. Some unsavory people try to use them to prove that white people are the real victims or the media is biased against white people or something. Other people who are very nice and optimistic use them to show that some white people have developed some self-awareness and are willing to engage in self-criticism.

But I think the situation with "white" is much the same as the situation with "American" ? it can either mean what it says, or be a code word for the Red Tribe


(except on the blog Stuff White People Like, where it obviously serves as a code word for the Blue tribe. I don't know, guys. I didn't do it.)

I realize that?s making a strong claim, but it would hardly be without precedent. When people say things like "gamers are misogynist", do they mean the 52% of gamers who are women? Do they mean every one of the 59% of Americans from every walk of life who are known to play video or computer games occasionally? No. "Gamer" is a coded reference to the Gray Tribe, the half-branched-off collection of libertarianish tech-savvy nerds, and everyone knows it. As well expect that when people talk about "fedoras", they mean Indiana Jones. Or when they talk about "urban youth", they mean freshmen at NYU. Everyone knows exactly who we mean when we say "urban youth", and them being young people who live in a city has only the most tenuous of relations to the actual concept.

And I'm saying words like "American" and "white" work the same way. Bill Clinton was the "first black President", but if Herman Cain had won in 2012 he'd have been the 43rd white president. And when an angry white person talks at great length about how much he hates "white dudes", he is not being humble and self-critical.

This essay is bad and I should feel bad.

I should feel bad because I made exactly the mistake I am trying to warn everyone else about, and it wasn?t until I was almost done that I noticed.

How virtuous, how noble I must be! Never stooping to engage in petty tribal conflict like that silly Red Tribe, but always nobly criticizing my own tribe and striving to make it better.

Yeah. Once I've written a ten thousand word essay savagely attacking the Blue Tribe, either I'm a very special person or they're my outgroup. And I?m not that special.

Just as you can pull a fast one and look humbly self-critical if you make your audience assume there's just one American culture, so maybe you can trick people by assuming there's only one Blue Tribe.

I'm pretty sure I'm not Red, but I did talk about the Grey Tribe above, and I show all the risk factors for being one of them. That means that, although my critique of the Blue Tribe may be right or wrong, in terms of motivation it comes from the same place as a Red Tribe member talking about how much they hate al-Qaeda or a Blue Tribe member talking about how much they hate ignorant bigots. And when I boast of being able to tolerate Christians and Southerners whom the Blue Tribe is mean to, I?m not being tolerant at all, just noticing people so far away from me they wouldn't make a good outgroup anyway.

I had fun writing this article. People do not have fun writing articles savagely criticizing their in-group. People can criticize their in-group, it's not humanly impossible, but it takes nerves of steel, it makes your blood boil, you should sweat blood. It shouldn't be fun.

You can bet some white guy on Gawker who week after week churns out "Why White People Are So Terrible? and "Here's What Dumb White People Don't Understand" is having fun and not sweating any blood at all. He's not criticizing his in-group, he's never even considered criticizing his in-group. I can't blame him. Criticizing the in-group is a really difficult project I've barely begun to build the mental skills necessary to even consider.

Of course Karen isn't unambiguously code word for red tribe in fact there's a lot of liberal/centrist women who are Karens. But Matt Walsh has aligned himself with liberal terfs and similar figures so he vaguely sees it as ingroup criticism now lol. Which is actually (unironically) kind of fascinating psychologically lol.

These are the tribes btw (I think they're and this blog post is slightly outdated now but not very):

The people who are actually into this sort of thing sketch out a bunch of speculative tribes and subtribes, but to make it easier, let me stick with two and a half.

The Red Tribe is most classically typified by conservative political beliefs, strong evangelical religious beliefs, creationism, opposing gay marriage, owning guns, eating steak, drinking Coca-Cola, driving SUVs, watching lots of TV, enjoying American football, getting conspicuously upset about terrorists and commies, marrying early, divorcing early, shouting "USA IS NUMBER ONE!!!", and listening to country music.

The Blue Tribe is most classically typified by liberal political beliefs, vague agnosticism, supporting gay rights, thinking guns are barbaric, eating arugula, drinking fancy bottled water, driving Priuses, reading lots of books, being highly educated, mocking American football, feeling vaguely like they should like soccer but never really being able to get into it, getting conspicuously upset about sexists and bigots, marrying later, constantly pointing out how much more civilized European countries are than America, and listening to "everything except country".

(There is a partly-formed attempt to spin off a Grey Tribe typified by libertarian political beliefs, Dawkins-style atheism, vague annoyance that the question of gay rights even comes up, eating paleo, drinking Soylent, calling in rides on Uber, reading lots of blogs, calling American football "sportsball", getting conspicuously upset about the War on Drugs and the NSA, and listening to filk ? but for our current purposes this is a distraction and they can safely be considered part of the Blue Tribe most of the time)

I think these "tribes" will turn out to be even stronger categories than politics. Harvard might skew 80-20 in terms of Democrats vs. Republicans, 90-10 in terms of liberals vs. conservatives, but maybe 99-1 in terms of Blues vs. Reds.

Gamers status fluctuates a lot I don't think it's ever red tribe but it definitely moves between far left and far right and some parts are blue tribe or blue tribe adj as well.

[Doseone]

Chimichangas are amazing.

[Nyctophilia]

Just spousal rape things 🥰🥰🥰

It should be equally frowned upon for a woman to deny sex to her husband as it is for a man to step out on a relationship

Nah she's cooking frfr

Yeah, crack

Meth ?

😂

Why would people treat this differently to any other relationship? People wouldn't even consider arguing this for a relationship that isn't a marriage. Another reason to not be in favour of marriage honestly besides the creepy legal shit. If you can't come to a mutually satisfying solution then just break up.

It looks like she's still trying to defend cheating. It's weird because she spends a lot of time criticising female behaviour looking through her recent tweets. Like 'it's fine for a guy to break up with a woman if she has an onlyfans account but you shouldn't break up with your male partner if he cheats on you.' Well it's not weird because she's obviously grifting and/or looking for male attention but yeah. You can't argue it's different somehow but then also spend a lof of time trying to convince others to go along with that. If it was really different you wouldn't have to sit on twitter trying to convince people lol. But yeah women already forgive men for sexual infidelity more often than straight men do (gay men don't care as much,) but to the extent they don't that's to be expected and you should stfu lol. It's everytime I've stumbled on her account lol.

It's also just stupid to spend a lot of time trying to convince people to change how they feel about personal relationship stuff. I sort of get the attempt if you're really struggling to find a partner and want people to change behaviour to be more appealing to you personally (I mean I see why you might try,) but yeah anyway that's not what she's doing she's just trying to get male attention and probably $$$ some way or other. I think what she's doing is worse than onlyfans lol.

There's a video called MGTOW ASMR by 'the book club/q reviews' but the original channel was deleted, it's been reuploaded but is too sexually graphic to post here. It's very what she's doing. It's mostly an entertaining video because of the mental breakdown in what looks like an attic vibe.

Lol wtf looks like he started his channel again and uploaded a video 5 months ago. I think he deletes it and makes a new one now and then so it never gets too popular/too many subscribers due to the crazy offensive and sometimes sexual humour. For me though it's just a surreal experience especially with the editing where nothing is really said and you feel like you're on drugs while watching. You know speaking of crack. (I think at least his older content is to the video essay what It's Always Sunny is to a sitcom.)

[Nyctophilia]

I got 13/15 almost scored 14/15 but ended up changing my answer to 8 😔

Also there's somewhat of an issue with the test in that:

Spoiler: A bunch of the answers fall into a predictable alternating pattern. And it might help to have more options to make it less guessable.

Nobody seems to be posting a low score so I find that suspicious. It's like IQ test results or penis size.

[Nyctophilia]

The intense cruelty and psychopathy of many people online is a lot. Like a multiple paragraph copypasta of transphobic [BEEP] that it seems was created to try and get trans women to kill themselves.

Also a decent portion of it was just going on about how 'men are specifically designed to sniff out fakes' etc and 'thousands of years of evolution' It's just weird to think your sexual opinion is so important. And then society just bends over backwards to cater to your sexuality. Well a big part of that is $$$ obviously but yeah. There's the whole 'comphet' thing too which is more common probably for trans women but I've read a lot of posts from cis women too. Where men are essentially used as a way to prove womanhood/femininity.

He also referred to cis women as 'nature's perfection' OK. That's a common view point among conservative men actually.





Which means trans women are closer to perfection than you no? According to your own logic. You didn't think about that. It would be easy to be very cruel about it. Conservatives actually have a very low opinion of men lol. In their own way.

(I was somewhat deconstructing Jordan Peterson's thesis here pornographically a decade+ before I even knew he existed haha. Very funny. Many such cases.)

This paper too:

"As I weed through all these terms, what I'm trying to show here is that misogyny is an action that is about controlling the behavior of women," said Robinson, who in this research introduces the concept "transamorous misogyny." The term is intended to capture the paradox in how cisgender heterosexual men claim they desire trans women, but disrespect cisgender women through comparisons, reaffirming their own masculinity.

"This hyper-femininity expected of trans women can shape cis men's desire as well," said Robinson, chair of UCR's Gender and Sexuality Department, who is currently working on their next book about trans women?s dating and hookup lives.

That is, this shift to being attracted to gender expression and away from being attracted to a person's gender works by partly denying trans women as women, as the cis men focus more on their femininity as proof of their womanhood and not on them just being women.

Yeah OK. Are you ever going to research trans masculine or non-binary people's sexuality? I guess not unless more trans men and non-binary people become sexologists. Or even cis women lol. Like imagine a paper about cis women attracted to trans women. It's never going to exist lol. It's so boring and painfully heteronormative. Every study about trans women in sexology I come across seems to be about cis men's desire for trans women too. Or 'lets see if cis het and cis gay men are attracted to trans women again.'

I posit, however, that we should not just see these desires just through the lens of fetishization. Notably, constantly calling these acts fetishizing and objectifying can make it seem like these acts and desires are exceptional, missing how they are quotidian parts of how cis men construct and understand their cis heterosexual masculinity in everyday life.

That is, I document the misogyny paradox through cis men's discourses of loathing cis women for not performing femininity and submissiveness well enough, while discursively positioning trans women as hyper-feminine and hyper-submissive and constructing their desires for trans women as the ultimate masculine superiority. The cis men, though, also still reconstruct cis women as the unmarked norm by comparing trans women to "women" as though trans women are not also already women.

Instead, we might also see these sexist desires as rooted in misogyny and how misogyny shapes cis heterosexual men's desire more broadly and how most cis heterosexual men understand and reassert their cis heterosexual masculinity

Me at this point:



Write about meeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee.

Yes me specifically. Write a 10 thousand word paper about my weird obsession with skinny 1970s bassist lead vocalists with high pitched voices and long wavy hair and glasses. And by paper I mean non-binary lesbian romance story. And by bassist vocalist I mean academic that has a music studio in their attic and also has a collection of plants and a cat. And by non-binary lesbian romance story I mean film that gets turned into fanfics. I haven't quite pieced the rest together but maybe they have sex with someone in an office or a library- oh wait that's just that one yaoi series subplot junjou egoist I keep accidentally stealing from with the tsundere professor and younger guy fused with dark academia and 50% of the other fetish interests I've acquired. What if they worked in the library and had glasses. And I was there in the library. That would be so hot.

What if I just met a hot person in a library.



They can't because I'm more annoying lol. And that would ruin certain narratives.

"I think I'm looking at Zhou from a male perspective. I sometimes feel like if I were a man, I might like this guy. When I watch the show, I also take the perspective of Wen." - Wang, pers. comm., April 28th, 2021

"I want to [BEEP] him but I don't have a penis." - Tushounangua, pers. comm., April 29th, 2021

Academics: "Is this the female gaze?" 🤣

https://www.researchgate.net/publica...021_Case_Study

Hahahaha. In fairness they kind of addressed their opinion on that:

First, nisu replicates male supremacy. As a way of empowering women under the pressure of patriarchal power, the nisu reflects a kind of reverse gaze of females towards males. However, the essence of this kind of gaze is the same as that of the male gaze, which is a reproduction of gender hegemonism. Some nisu fans satisfy the desire and proclaim power by objectifying males instead of pursuing reconciliation of gender conflict and reconstruction of gender order.

I'm being attacked by an aggressive moth again that I think I just woke up by moving something. Rude. So many moths here lately and after a long period of no moths.

[Nyctophilia]

I was listening to this in the background while doing something else and in the last several minutes they talk about the gender war on social media between men and women and then very briefly at the end the guy he's talking to brings up 'you can create in group/out group in the non-binary discussion' and he responds 'well there's a million different outgroups there' which is interesting because it's incorrect.

I can see how as an outsider you'd assume that based on the memes but while there is arguing within say the LGBT+ community online over microlabels for both sexuality and gender (moreso sexuality microlabels at this point honestly,) there aren't enough people to really form large scape groups that way or debates that are ongoing. They're not true tribes or ingroups and outgroups so to speak.

So what you get instead as the breakdown is you have the cis woman vs cis men thing of course which is the primary gender war in society and then you have trans women vs afab non-binary people and trans men. Amab non-binary people are a much smaller group and they sometimes will get grouped in with trans women but are often ignored. And there's the transfeminist thing where it's like trans women vs everyone else in society because through that lens trans women are seen as the most oppressed in society and then there's the weird fight that's specifically between trans women and afab non-binary people and that's actually more intense and polarised than the one between trans men and trans women actually so it doesn't mirror the gender war in cis society in that sense. You also have in 4chan related spaces and trans med spaces especially trans men and trans women teaming up against afab non-binary people so that happens as well but those people aren't really transfeminists which is why they're able to do that.

But yeah those are essentially the groups and although you can break non-binary down further at the very least between bigender(identify as both male and female,) and agender people (they don't identify as male or female,) but politically speaking the divide isn't based on identity that way. It's based on your perceived femininity if you're afab because you're expected to resemble a man by the community if you're afab, or sometimes you're expected to look very androgynous one or the other. And the second overlapping divide is whether or not you've medically transitioned. Transmed people also don't like 'people with beards and dresses' which mostly refers to a subset of amab non-binary people.

I spoke about this before a bit but I think the reason there's more animosity between non-binary afab people and trans women than say trans men and trans women which would seem to make more sense is firstly that afab non-binary people are a larger group of course so the numbers. Also trans women's issue with feminine afab people in particular is partly driven by envy because they want to be or resemble afab people and I think some of them find the fact that they might look the way they want to look but choose to reject femaleness in various ways like adopting certain pronouns annoying. They also assume they experience no dysphoria at all where as they usually have more physical dysphoria. In reverse I think a lot of afab non-binary people actually want to look more like androgynous men and sometimes like trans women. They want to look mostly female/feminine but have a dick or something like that so I think there's probably some envy there as well.

Oh and having observed this fighting terfs sometimes pretend to be non-binary online now to [BEEP] with trans women and also attempt to recruit non-binary people (they attempt to recruit all afab people of course but yeah.) So then that annoys some people. And then there's this weird group of people who do things irl like have apartment adverts or whatever or other groups that are 'afab only' and only group non-binary people with women and then assume that all non-binary people are genetically female and haven't medically transitioned. I'm not sure if the people who advertise these things are usually non-binary though maybe sometimes. I don't understand the mentality and as I've said before I actively avoided staying in female only apartment at one point in the past because that would make me uncomfortable. I once lived with 5 guys (but I did know 4 of them beforehand tbf.) I've been in a lot of spaces which are mostly male as well. So anyway yeah that has nothing to do with me lol.

Another thing is there's a lot of misogyny as well that takes place in some areas of the internet + sexism and a dislike of femininity in trans men or afab trans people in general. In particular on 4chan related subreddits and trans men will also criticise afab non-binary people for being feminine and they don't want to be associated with them and things like that. So they'll also team up at times. And this overlaps with the transmed vs not trans med debate but there's something a bit more fucked in the head (not mincing words lol,) about 4chan related spaces obviously. And there's a culture of hybristophilia and related fetishes over there so they kind of sexualise very masculine psychopathic trans men (and men in general sometimes, but moreso trans men honestly.) I saw a post yesterday where they were all doing that and some of it's probably shitposting but some of it isn't. Example (it's quite cringe actually but yeah):

Ftms are either theyfab autists or this. No inbetween.

[they posted a screenshot but too big to embed so quoting... I haven't corrected their grammar etc. Mostly because they're doing that 'never capitalise i' thing that is ironic in a post like this.]

i'm so fucking tired of being a girl. The societal role of being a woman makes me want to poke my eyes out and makes me sick. i hate being wanted, perceived as sexy or cute. i suffer psychologically it feels like everyone had lost their fucking minds treating me like a vulnerable short girl, it feels like im not aware of some kind of an inside joke that everybody gets except me. i don't even care about how my body looks. i just want to be threatening and scary as fuck. and no, being a "dommy mommy" isn't enough. i want to be fucking creepy and uncomfortable, i want the power that comes with being a man, i want to see genuine fear in somebody's eyes, and not like the part of the roleplay. i just genuinely want to be a walking toxic masculinity type. i just want to violently [redacted] i'm so tired of being weak and put down automatically by everyone just because i was born in this body. im not rebelling or anything i don't want any revenge or some crazy feminist shit. it's just so fucking sad realizing that i would never be something that i really am deep inside. i just want to be dominant in every way possible. i wish i had a cock so fucking badly too. i really like to take advantage of people. i always want to be in charge. i will never be fully happy because of this.

Lol Sylvia Plath after she did all that meth tbh:

"Yes, my consuming desire is to mingle with road crews, sailors and soldiers, barroom regulars--to be a part of a scene, anonymous, listening, recording--all this is spoiled by the fact that I am a girl, a female always supposedly in danger of assault and battery. My consuming interest in men and their lives is often misconstrued as a desire to seduce them, or as an invitation to intimacy. Yes, God, I want to talk to everybody as deeply as I can. I want to be able to sleep in an open field, to travel west, to walk freely at night..."

Fairly sure there's some middle ground between the two extremes that I occupy lol but OK..

There were a mix of responses but some were like (I actually removed the craziest stuff lol):

i need him

I can fix him

what is there to fix?

FUCKING NEED

Waow. (Based, Based, Based, Based, Based, Based, Based, Based, Based, Based, Based, Based)

Crazy how I always see ftms saying "I'm glad I was socialized female so I'm not like all those toxic evil cis men 🥺" I thought we all wanted to be significantly worse than the average cis guy but were crippled by dickless manlet status?

I feel like there's probably some middle ground here. Crazy concept I guess. And that middle ground is this band I must have posted 6 times at least:

need mister creepy scary many man over here to [BEEP] the [BEEP] out of me

So the culture is quite toxic and driven towards promoting masculine antisocial sexuality and behaviour. They invented the term theyfab (I think it's fairly similar to how f*g is used but specifically for afab people,) then eventually it got picked up by twitter and morphed for a few different but related purposes. I believe there was some instagram post that used that term that Hunter Schafer (famous trans actress) ended up liking. So that really did numbers.

So yeah that's a huge disaster but needless to say there aren't really a million gender groups in society politically speaking it's more like 6? and those 6 are often dissolved into fewer groups depends on the context.

This is why I'm also against sex essentialism because that's not how people are socialised (or not might be more apt in some cases.) You can't just pretend antisocial genetic females don't exist.

[Nyctophilia]

We've reached the point where Christian white nationalist anti Jewish, anti-lgbt twitter accounts (yes all of that in recent tweets how much bigotry are you collecting here? It's not Pokemon,) are reminiscing about the 70s.

Ew. you stole my 2023 thing bitch.

But also things are really progressing. the 50s are almost out. (I mean not really, the tradwives are still around, but yeah now there are different shades of racist annoying people.)

They steal everything too without adding anything. They stole the vaporwave + synthwave thing 'fashwave.' God damn get some creativity fash.

Do you know who helped popularise the aesthetic + microgenre?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ramona_Andra_Langley

Under various aliases, Langley played a role in the creation of the modern electronic genre vaporwave between 2010 and 2013.[9][10] Her projects, Macintosh Plus and New Dreams Ltd., are considered as the primary artists in the vaporwave genre.[11][12]

Langley now resides in Portland, Oregon.[2] She is a trans woman.[13]

Also Tumblr obviously.


---


Elon Musk: Working from home is morally wrong.

Also Elon Musk: has kids with independent music artist who def mostly works from home. Is billionaire.

OK. Bye.

'the laptop class is living in La la land'

First of all: not a class. Some people are underpaid/living below the poverty line while working from home, others are multi-millionaires.

Secondly...

YOU HAVE A PRIVATE JET.



He's got to be trolling. He's just pissed because nobody's breeding so he can't force your non existent kids to work for him in some Mars factory.

Edit: Actually what he's doing is attempting to pit people against each other as it distracts from him but yeah. He is also a huge troll.

[Nyctophilia]

"To any parents who have a child who would have a transgender surgery done on them they need to be shot in the back of the head. They need to be convicted in trial and immediately shot in the back of the head. And then we can string them up above a bridge. So the public can see the consequences of that kind of wickedness. So there should be no excuse to not put these people to death. No excuse whatsoever. [...] and let me tell you there are very few people out there in the world today that are actually fighting the spiritual fight. I want you to go ahead and find me another preacher in Spokane that preached the message where they said that these child molestors, that these child butchers, that these f*****s, all the LGBTQ people. People who desire strange flesh. That they should all be put to death in a public execution by the government. Find me the preacher that says that. I wanna see him."

The Christians are being Christ like again. I too remember the part in the bible where Jesus was like 'lynch the LGBTQ F****** and make an example of them.' His name is Jason Graber apparently (found the full video after googling 45 minutes into this. It's actually even crazier he starts ranting about how it might be a good thing if some cities were burnt down and the federal government should invade Washington):



edit: it's private now that was quick. Was the original upload they were obviously getting too much heat over the past several hours.

'Little Johnny at 6 years old he shouldn't know the difference between men and women. He should just know mum is mum and dad is dad. And I don't hit my little sister and I wrestle with my big brother that's all kids should know.' meh me and my brother would play fight a bunch and actually fight on a couple of occasions (not that that was OK lol. But there's also little to no difference in physical strength among prepubescent children. One time I kicked him in the back and another time he hit me with a bamboo cane. I only remember that specific example because it hurt lol. Oh yeah and he chucked like a tiny toy table at me once and it was the same week we had pictures taken at school so I had this like cut under my eye. Actually when I kicked him in the back that's the angriest I've ever seen my dad get. He was like 'you could have damaged his kidneys.' My brother was kind of crazy though until about age 11 one time he actually chucked a brick at a girl or something. We both became huge nerds lol.) Though I'm older than him by a year and a half and most people thought we were twin girls when we were really young anyway.

'Men with men and women with women. That's what it's talking about people who have an unnatural lust. The bible says it's unnatural. The bible makes it clear that they are to be put to death. And I'm sick of these Christians that fail to advocate for that and they make all kinds of excuses for why the bible doesn't really say what the bible actually says and is clear about.

It doesn't really say much about specifics at all and definitely never says anything about women with women because most people throughout history haven't been able to wrap their heads around that. They only really get threatened by butch women stealing their girlfriends in some cultures. And the 'they're stealing all our wombs' thing obviously.

One of the excuses is that they need to get saved though they need to turn to Christ and get saved. Well they can't. They've already made their choice and the bible is clear.

When the devil is your daddy. what are you gonna do about that? There's nothing you can do about that. You become a son of belial and you can become a f***** too.

Lol. That word has been ruined forever. Also 'even worse than being a devil child you could be gay.' Oh no.

That's what the federal government should be doing in Washington. [...] The federal government needs to protect people's rights. And the rights of children and the rights of parents are about to be violated in a horrible way in this state. The federal government should be showing up with tanks, planes, and bombs and say 'hand over the sons of Belial. Give us the sons of Belial we can put them to death and put away wickedness.' [...] Every single church should be thundering this forth that that is what should happen to those wicked, disgusting people.

Oh the irony hahaha.

There should be no excuse not to put these people to death. No excuses whatsoever.

They can't feel empathy anymore. They're past feeling. They don't feel affection. These people have the moral compass of a chimp.

You may be projecting a bit haha.

Otherwise we're going to lose the spiritual battle.

Have you considered playing video games instead?

I don't know what we're going to do about the sodomite problem in Washington. It may never be taken care of until Jesus comes but you know what when Jesus comes it will be taken care of. God is going to have them slain. [...] even if we never have physical justice which I doubt we'll ever have [..] God will have justice upon their souls. These people are going to burn in the lowest hell for all eternity and I'm going to say amen.

Well that's rude. Also I hope Jesus appreciates all the Jesus/Satan fanfiction. I'll have to make sure to ask him about that before burning in hell forever. They're just so cute together. #foeyay.

I joke but I don't think there's a more fucked up abusive thing you can do then try to convince people they're going to burn in hell forever. Also this religion makes no sense (for so many reasons but why would Satan torture people forever according to the rules of a God he hates/resents and punish people who supposedly are helping him? Is he being forced? The plot holes. If it wasn't for the tragic love story between Jesus and Satan I'd give this a 0/10)

Looks like he has a history of saying people should be shot and beheaded. He previously said teachers should be beheaded for teaching kids about LGBTQ+ people. He just reminds me of my dad when he gets mad about groups he doesn't like and just starts ranting aggressively, only my dad does it in his living room and not in front of a bunch of mindless followers.

Also kids don't have surgery. They go on puberty blockers sometimes, and then later hrt. I think in some rare cases in the US people who are age 16~ get top surgery (so a mastectomy not genital surgery,) but that's very rare. You also need consent from all legal guardians + multiple mental health professionals. I also don't think there's generally a need for that if you're not going through female puberty in the first place. Otherwise can wait till 18. I do think it's misleading and hypocritical to claim this age group are kids though because these are people who can usually consent to sex, get pregnant, play risky high school sports like American football, and if they're 17 their parents can give permission for them to die in a war.

Also going to start referring to myself as 'person who desires strange flesh.'

Imagine living in Washington. Sorry I couldn't hear you over the sound of





Who even are you?:



(Of course he's basically the opposite of the girl in this scene ironically lol)

This is basically almost entirely unrelated (Billie Joe is bisexual? lol. They're from Northern California.) just funny and I just found it. I like this performance too:



Wonder if that inspired the title of this later song lol:



Edit:

omg I almost forgot.

Langley was born in Washington state on August 19, 1992.[2]

[Heelsbythebridge]

Oh darn it, I've overeaten again

[Nyctophilia]

Edit: I'm focussing on afab (genetic female) transitioners in this post because the current moral panic around trans kids is based on the idea that the number has dramatically increased and this is only really true significantly in afab teenagers. If they come out as teenagers they're late onset though Jordan Peterson seems confused about this based on things I've heard him say in other videos but they would be late onset. His claim that early onset amab (genetic male) kids usually grow up gay - so they're attracted to men - if they don't transition and/or grow out of dysphoria is accurate if they're early onset so they come out in early childhood, but the number of trans kids in this group has not increased significantly over time so this is essentially irrelevant. For early onset afab kids his claim isn't true at all though. Most females in research who 'desist' are attracted to men later on so they're not gay, and the detransistioner he's talking to in the discussion/therapy session/whatever that is is also female and I'm fairly sure also late onset (though really she doesn't fit either type/profile well based on things I've heard her say in the video,) so this is irrelevant info for her. Whether or not everyone who doesn't transition is happier is also debatable. Transphobes would assume that by default, but that's open for debate.)

Went through this big time 10-17 years old. Everyday i felt like a freak.
Eventually built 2 persons within myself and locked the "her" away from the world.

Numbed it with drugs and booze. Now 7 years sober and 31 years old..i have had waves of dysphoria come and go over the years, less intense though. Iv rejected the lgbtq community because i did not want to accept that i might actually fit in, i have alot of internalizes transphobia i now know i need to deal with, and start dealing with the girl iv locked away for years.

J.P is a great person and clinician, iv had the ability to see both sides of these points of veiw.
There has to be an alternative to taking HRT right ???

No he really isn't a great person and he's contributing to people being stuck in this state due to his complete lack of understanding about gender identity and general intolerance. He acts like 'if you just leave kids alone they'll be fine after puberty and maybe 80% grow up gay.' First of all he's only talking about early onset trans kids who come out in early childhood and make up an extreme minority of trans people and the number in this group has not significantly increased! The increase has been mostly in late onset teenagers especially afab/genetically female teenagers. They often confuse their parents by from their pov randomly announcing they are trans out of the blue when they were gender conforming and often feminine children. (Mildly tomboyish at the most.)

Instead of addressing that he discusses the early onset group and people will assume this refers to anyone under 18. Also I know the interview this is from and I really doubt the person he was talking to was early onset herself. She's not non-conforming enough imo even now she's detransitioned but also she talks about how before puberty she was looking forward to growing breasts etc and then when she started puberty she had a small chest and this distressed her. She compared herself to girls with hourglass figures and felt bad she didn't measure up to that (whereas if you listen to other people with early onset dysphoria who grow out of it later on they'll talk about how they never wanted to grow breasts and thankfully never did and things like that. Also most trans people regardless of type feel similarly and often want to look more androgynous or masculine/feminine than they do. In fact most cis lesbians wouldn't relate to this either even if they never felt dysphoric. Research shows that the beauty standards among lesbians favour looking more androgynous and they also care less than straight women about body image so that's something else you have to bear in mind when considering this topic. As an anecdotal example Strange Aeons is a reasonably feminine lesbian though she doesn't id as femme she made that kind of clear lol, she dates butch women preferentially and she's still talked about how when she was a teenager she wanted to look like that male character from Code Geass - Lelouch right. I'm sure there are exceptions there are some incredibly feminine lesbian women like Jessica Kellgren-Fozard, but I think the person JP was talking to is probably also straight but that's largely irrelevant.) Absolutely no early onset people feel that way though (because they are the most masculine and male identified if afab hence why their dysphoria starts in early childhood,) though they usually assume they will grow up to be men until they learn otherwise actually.

edit: From what I remember from one study among early onset kids it showed that the girls who were straight grew out of their dysphoria because they had to compete for boys. That was often brought up in interviews I remember reading at some point. I'm going back over this chat discussion because I don't think I ever ended up bookmarking that study. It varies depending on location and treatment plan.

I think in the Netherlands, most of the gynephiles persist, while in Zucker's sample, something like 3/4 gynephiles desist

among AMABs, the desisters are either sexual orientation; persisters are androphilic most of the time though
among AFABs, persistence is almost perfectly correlated with sexual orientation
at least in the dutch clinic

I can't believe you're performing factor analysis to figure out the exact category borders for obscure fetishes and you still think this shouldn't be your official field

lol.

Why can't I find this one study...

so many of Zucker's desisters are straight
why is everyone using desisters to rant about gay conversion stuff?
also, apparently Zucker doesn't define desistance in the stupid way that some other people do?

Omfg the sci-hub link is expired... Because the chat is from 2018. Nobody has written the title of this in the chat.

I mean, really the problem is that everyone else goes with the "most childhood GID cases end up cis gay" and that's not really what e.g. zucker found

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

(╯O□O)╯︵ ┻━┻

Lol.

OK looking at a blog post... A response to someone.

"Despite the differences in country, culture, decade, and follow-up length and method, all the studies have come to a remarkably similar conclusion: Only very few trans- kids still want to transition by the time they are adults. Instead, they generally turn out to be regular gay or lesbian folks."

However, while this is an accurate summary of the results in males, it is not an accurate summary of the results in females. Out of the 11 studies he cited, 7 studies dealt with males only, 1 study had only a single female participant, and only 3 studies had multiple female participants. Among the desisters, the studies with females got the following results:

Gender-disordered children: does inpatient treatment help?, R J Kosky 1987:
1 unknown sexual orientation.

Psychosexual outcome of gender-dysphoric children, M S C Wallien & P T Cohen-Kettenis 2008:
3 heterosexual

A follow-up study of girls with gender identity disorder, K Drummond, S Bradley, M Peterson-Badali & K Zucker:
16 heterosexual, 4 homosexual, and 2 bisexual

Factors associated with desistence and persistence of childhood gender dysphoria: a quantitative follow-up study, T Steensma, J McGuire, B Kreukels, A Beekman, P Cohen-Kettenis, 20131:
9-12 heterosexual, 1-3 bisexual

Thus, looking over the studies that Cantor cited, there were 41 female desisters, of which 28-31 appear to be heterosexual, 3-5 appear to be bisexual, and 2 appear to be lesbian. This does not seem to match the idea that they generally turn out to be regular lesbian folks; rather they seem to generally turn out to be heterosexual.

[...]

Overall, persistence among natal females appears to be near-perfectly correlated with sexual orientation. What to make of this correlation is unclear, but certainly it seems to make [name's] characterization inaccurate.

So his claim appears erroneous for early onset dysphoria in the first place unless there's some specific paper he's citing that doesn't reflect this trend, which is even more annoying. He's not a stupid person obviously which means he's likely doing this on purpose too. I think I read a comment earlier that suggested whatever he's citing was thrown out due to having too broad a definition of dysphoria or something like that too but can't clarify.

Oh I'm so mad. Thinking about this Contrapoints tweet:

You know who's being silenced? People who are silent.

Honestly is there any louder group of people in the national discourse than the people who are supposedly canceled

All the time I think about how nobody's challenging various people or pointing out various things. At least not people who are remotely high profile and getting seen visibly and the one person I used to talk to who had contact with people behind the scenes pretty much fell out with his contacts because they were all on that political trans skeptic train.

When I've tried to bring up my issues with their theories and methods, they have generally been unresponsive, and when I've tried to appeal to higher-level principles such as honesty, they've instead excluded me from conversation. This has made me mad at them, especially because it's hard to prove to others that they are dishonest, since much of the dishonesty has happened in private conversations, and since most people who criticize them are highly politically motivated.

Jordan Peterson really doesn't know what he's talking about and it's quite bad because people think of him as an expert. Not that it matters I guess, since most people are motivated by emotional response and personally knowing trans people and things like that not data.

I do forget that some conservative people (and others,) are a bit slow though due to a lack of exposure. Like they don't see the difference between different subgroups of female masculinity (trans or cis) So they can't see the difference between someone like these kids (who are tomboys):



or her:



(hence why she gets comments now like 'you've been replaced with a clone' even though she was never really butch. Kristen Stewart also confuses people. I think that's why she said she'd like her to play her in a biopic lol, but since they're about the same age that wouldn't really work.)

vs her:



I am trying to use examples who are relatively feminine presenting cause otherwise there's the confusion that comes with hair length etc. But because of that these examples are also more androgynous. Not just aesthetically but like in an identity sense:

"I'd call Shane androgynous," said Moennig, lighting up an American Spirit that a waiter will eventually ask her to extinguish (it seems last week fire marshals descended upon the famously fume-friendly Chateau). "I wouldn't call her butch at all. I don't think she has butch qualities, and she doesn't look butch. I think that's an easy label to make because she's not as feminine as the other girls. I'd call her androgynous because she is. And I'm androgynous."

^ This is kind of awkward watching it the whole way through now actually as she was probably closeted at the time and a lot of the questions are really personal.

Can't realistically post tons of examples here lol. Oh my god who the [BEEP] cares I know. Couldn't find an example of a long haired butch woman off the top of my head just found this comedian but without long hair lol:



They conflate a bunch of stuff together and also assume anyone mildly tomboyish will transition now which isn't the case.

It's not really the case that 'they're transing the lesbians' either. Way more complicated. Most of the afab teenagers (late onset to be clear,) are attracted to men... Some are bisexual/pansexual and a smaller percentage might be exclusively attracted to women, but some will also date women before transitioning because they don't like the idea of being in a straight relationship and because it's seen as more masculine to date women Just like some cis gay teenagers claim to be bisexual but then just accept they're gay later on. There are also many people who conclude they are asexual due to dysphoria surrounding sex/inability to have a fulfilling sex life etc. I also think having an estrogen dominant hormone system makes you slightly more fluid than you would otherwise be. But I dunno I just see that with some people who transition the other way where they were exclusively into cis men and then become somewhat attracted to women, trans men, feminine cis men when they were previously only into really masc guys or something like that. Gigi changed her sexuality label like 3-4 times as well lol. But the opposite also happens with trans women where they start dating guys post transition. there are various different social pressures as well depending on your sexuality before transition + the environment you're in + how you look/are perceived before transition. I imagine very feminine trans women don't even have the option to date women before transition cause everyone will assume and push them towards dating men anyway. Kat Blaque has spoken about that. Now people assume she's bisexual which annoys her lol since she is exclusively attracted to men. (I see why it happens though as she's read as afab non-binary if people think she's trans which gets coded as bisexual and something like 20% of black cis women are bisexual or lesbian and on top of that she dyes her hair unnatural colours.)

I mean this doctor has actually treated tons of trans people and noticed this:

I mean are there other verifiable physical things you've found in afab people who are non binary or trans? You mentioned several things in your lecture that pertained to trans women like this. Genetic conditions etc.

Oh, there are tons of them. Like every disorder that causes hirsutism or masculinization. Congenital adrenal hyperplasia, PCOS, certain enzyme deficiencies, all kinds of shit. Pretty much anything that causes them to pop an elevated value on one of the various androgen labs I order.

It's important to order those labs at the specific time as well. They need to be collected about 10 to 14 days after the last day of menstrual bleeding. You want to catch them when they're at a synthesis peak. When LH and FSH are highest and the ovaries are cranking out all they can. That's when you can see if they spike into the abnormal androgen ranges.

I mean, we all kind of subconsciously know this right? How many pre-HRT FTMs do you see that look like fucking Barbie? Almost zero. The overwhelming majority of them fall into two categories. What I call "pixie" type transgender men, who are about 4'10 to 5'3 and never really weigh more than 125 lb. They show up with short cropped hair and sort of have the look of an effeminate teenage boy. They often look younger than their stated age. They are usually attracted more to women with some degree of bisexual leaning, and after starting HRT, they generally become gay trans men. I often state that they were gay before and they are gay after. They rarely have abnormal androgens.

The other subset tends to be the stocky masc trans man. They come in like "Helga", a very muscular or thick bodied and masculine-looking person right at baseline. They often have a hairy upper lip or some degree of hirsutism and acne. They look like they have been on testosterone for a while already. They are usually attracted exclusively to women and previously identified as masculine presenting lesbians. They transition and tend to stay attracted only to women.

Not everybody falls in these two categories, but I'd say that this catches about 80% of my patients.

It is very interesting to me that if somebody is masculinized before starting HRT, their sexuality tends to stay the same. But if they look feminine and not masculinize before HRT, they flip in their gender of attraction.

Except pansexuals, they just get more pansexual.

I can personally attest to a patient that got angry at me for suggesting that this could happen. They told me dudes were disgusting and that they would only be interested in women ever. How dare I suggest otherwise. I said I would see them back in 3 months

6 weeks later they showed up for an appointment that I was surprised they had scheduled to tell me that they had had sex with five dudes since I last saw them and that they needed to go on prep.They gave me a profuse apology and told me that they couldn't believe it happened to them too.

So while I have certainly heard that, I have seen the opposite. I cannot tell you the amount of transgender men that have been exclusively with women that after testosterone initiation there was a major shift in their attractions.

I like to say that they were gay before and they're still gay!

lol (tinkerbell? It just gets worse and worse 😂 ):

Actually, when describing the situation to someone early in transition who is concerned about experiencing a sexual orientation change, yes. I do. I will describe the tinkerbell phenotype vs the amazonian phenotype and how I've seen this differential play out in 1,000 people over 8 years of doing this.

giving people examples of things that they know so that they can understand and comprehend what you're talking about helps them understand. It helps them make informed consent decisions about themselves and their HRT and their life. Using examples that are a bit silly puts people at ease, and helps them understand difficult concepts while making very important decisions. If you think a transgender person made it to my doorstep without life beating them up so much that they would be offended by such a phrase, you're surely mistaken. These are people who have been through hell already. They are not so made of tissue paper that a humorous exaggerated example of a body type or facial structure causes them any harm. I don't think you give transgender people enough respect for how tough they have to be just to live in this world.

But I wouldn't be calling you an adult man,Tinkerbell.

I would be describing to someone who has not started testosterone yet but who intends to do so that if they have this physical phenotype, they are more likely to experience a major change in their sexual orientation. I used the term because it's easy to understand. But if you would like to provide me with another example of a sharp featured, small, petite human being that is generally well liked to use in place of Tinkerbell, I welcome it.

It's not like some transgender man with a beard on t for 5 years walks in and because he's 5'1 I call him Tinkerbell. That's not what I mean.

I'm talking about someone who has recently identified as a lesbian and now is identifying as a straight transgender man that hey, if you fit this phenotype, I seen these people experience major sexual orientation changes more than if you fit this other phenotype.

I can't remember the last time I had a transgender man in my clinic who was pre-testosterone but looked like they could cause death by snu-snu on day zero but who later experienced an orientation flip.

I don't know why this is a thing, but I've definitely seen the pattern and other people have seen it as well.

The Tinkerbell thing definitely isn't okay in any context. I'm a nonbinary guy who practically considers myself "man lite" but even I nearly decided not to contribute because of your terminology. Not cool.

Meanwhile on 4chan:

i suffer psychologically it feels like everyone had lost their fucking minds treating me like a vulnerable short girl, it feels like im not aware of some kind of an inside joke that everybody gets except me. i don't even care about how my body looks. i just want to be threatening and scary as fuck. and no, being a "dommy mommy" isn't enough. i want to be fucking creepy and uncomfortable, i want the power that comes with being a man, i want to see genuine fear in somebody's eyes, and not like the part of the roleplay. i just genuinely want to be a walking toxic masculinity type. i just want to violently [redacted] i'm so tired of being weak and put down automatically by everyone just because i was born in this body. im not rebelling or anything i don't want any revenge or some crazy feminist shit. it's just so fucking sad realizing that i would never be something that i really am deep inside. i just want to be dominant in every way possible. i wish i had a cock so fucking badly too. i really like to take advantage of people. i always want to be in charge. i will never be fully happy because of this.

Feel like I need a video of this with like slow moving text (though it's not long enough for that. Just keep increasing the font size till it works lol) and this voice:



Of course the opposite sexuality thing happens too. Like that person who was obviously sadistic and went on testosterone and started having violent sexual fantasies about women. Eventually went off testosterone. Before and after that point I think they considered themselves asexual and they concluded it was just testosterone doing that but I don't 100% buy that. I think it's just really easy to avoid parts of your sexuality you dislike when you're not on testosterone. That's why they sometimes chemically castrate convicted sexual offenders after all.

Also this study found the opposite but it doesn't seem like a lot of his patients in general were identifying as androphilic pre-transition:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4192544/

FtM that had initially been sexually oriented towards males ( = androphilic), were significantly more likely to report on a change in sexual orientation than gynephilic, analloerotic or bisexual FtM (p  =  0.012).

By collecting quantitative and qualitative data in a large sample of transsexual persons, we demonstrate that self-reported change in sexual orientation is a common phenomenon in transsexual persons. Transition was not directly involved in this change, since a significant number of participants reported a change in sexual orientation prior to first psychological counseling and prior to initiation of cross-sex hormone treatment. The participants provided diverse individual explanation models, revealing that personal history, social environment as well as autoerotic feelings may impact on a change in sexual orientation.

Many complicated factors involved.

For years there was a weird imbalance among late onset trans people where it was mostly genetic males coming out and transitioning despite the sex ratio being more balanced in the early onset group. There were a very small number of trans guys who transitioned to live as gay men and they tended to have the same sexual preference of being attracted to androgynous men and trans women for whatever reason in the clinical research (kind of similar to me, and there's still a bunch of people around like this, though I have not medically transitioned and I'm mostly closeted too. I'm 32 and this is more common the older you get. Many will say 'why is it just teenagers? Why isn't there a trend of older people?' Well you just ignore us. We're incredibly invisible and personally I have a lot of social anxiety.) This has since shifted so there's more people coming out and medically transitioning but nobody curiously cared about the sex imbalance before when the end result suited their desired outcome.

But now it's all 'they're stealing our precious wombs for the white race, and our butch lesbian women, and transing Virginia Woolf.'

I just want to resurrect her to see people freak out about her saying this:

I mean, what is a woman? I assure you, I do not know. I do not believe that you know. I do not believe that anybody can know until she has expressed herself in all the arts and professions open to human skill.

Terfs really love her but if she (or anyone,) were to say something like this today they'd explode.

edit: Exactly really this has not been properly addressed:

To support the hypothesis of ROGD, studies would have to reject the null hypothesis. This null hypothesis -- that so-called ROGD is a typical presentation of late-onset gender dysphoria among youth with unsupportive parents -- is much more plausible given the currently available data. Littman's study fails altogether to demonstrate the existence of a new clinical population. For the most part, the hypothesis of ROGD has been predicated on the belief that late-onset gender dysphoria was inapplicable, a belief that is grounded in the mistaken assumption that late-onset gender dysphoria is nearly exclusive to children assigned male at birth.

https://psychcentral.com/lib/there-i...sphoria-exists

The study also found that the percentage of teens openly identifying as transgender or gender diverse (TGD) did not increase between 2017 and 2019. Additionally, contrary to past research with smaller samples, teens assigned female at birth were not overrepresented among TGD adolescents in the U.S. It is the largest study to date to examine the controversial hypothesis that more adolescents who were assigned female at birth have identified as TGD because of 'social contagion.' The study adds important new knowledge to the evolving field of transgender health care and ongoing public debate of legislative measures regulating access to gender-affirming health care.

"The hypothesis that transgender and gender diverse youth assigned female at birth identify as transgender due to social contagion does not hold up to scrutiny and should not be used to argue against the provision of gender-affirming medical care for adolescents," said study senior author Dr. Alex S. Keuroghlian, who directs the National LGBTQIA+ Health Education Center at The Fenway Institute and the Massachusetts General Hospital Psychiatry Gender Identity Program.

https://fenwayhealth.org/new-study-e...se-identities/

I still think these claims are sexism. They were literally like 'we've neglected you in research since the very beginning due to a lack of interest/paternalistic viewpoint of female sexuality, dismissed every example of your sexuality when it comes up in academic papers etc or historical figures as some kind of feminist expression see also this paper for a recent example on a Chinese sexual subculture where there are multiple anecdotes of people adopting the male pov/wanting dicks etc, we'll dismiss any evidence outside the West by claiming it's feminism too or as a result of exposure to Western culture (like some guy I showed this study to who didn't believe late onset or the associated sexuality was a thing in genetic females, lots of examples in Japan too etc. When I showed him a paper about Thailand that there were a lot more androgynous trans masc people and various labels they use over there that differ from here who modelled themselves on kpop stars, weren't super masc, and some anecdotes about people dating/pursuing men which was also indicative, he dismissed this too in a similar manner,) and now we're just going to insist while simply surveying a bunch of transphobic parents on a biased website that this is just hysteria! But just in case we also lowkey think if you were hypothetically to have some sexuality.. That's still hysteria/social contagion too!' (yes I've seen this opinion from a minority who even bother to address the association in the first place. It's like a flow chart where everything has to end in social contagion/hysteria because they want to control you/convert you.)

Wow. [BEEP] you.

[Nyctophilia]

every System of a Down song is like--

i'm the mushroom man, i'm the mushroom man. oh ho! oh! oh! In June 2003, Amnesty International published reports of human rights abuses by the U.S. military and its coalition partners at detention centers and prisons in Iraq.[26] These inclu-

LOL kinda true. More so if you consider entire albums.

So you listened to Sugar

You're all wrong it's clearly Prison Song

Definitely lol.





https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ENBv2i88g6Y

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zUzd9KyIDrM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1J47DrMXQ8Y

[Nyctophilia]

I never send my friend music because he basically only listens to Muse and Queen oh yeah and also likes this one Marina and the Diamonds track (which I also like also a bunch of Muse songs and some Queen tracks but I'm not picky with music lol,) but I was like this song is just so good though (I first listened to it like a month or more ago but was like listening to it while cooking and then was like this is really good. So I randomly felt like linking this.) Anyway he was like

Wtf it's 20 minutes long

Do you ever listen to normal length tracks?

I'm listening now

Two and half minutes of intro

xD

probably the last time I linked him something may have been a Porcupine Tree track or something ages ago so that might be why lol. But actually most tracks I listen to are relatively short.

Hate the vocals

The audacity.

Actually so many people say that lol. They seem to be an acquired taste but I really like them. I linked him a couple of other tracks and he wasn't a fan either. Besides sort of liking the intro to A Farewell to Kings but then didn't like the cool part later somehow. I actually told him to maybe skip that part lol.

I?m just not that into music xD

😔

lol.

He thought this was a bit better lol so guess more into the 80s sounding stuff I like a bunch of tracks but I prefer their proggier 70s music:



Still said he wouldn't listen to it again though lol.

Also watching this now:



'We talk about weed like the entire time' Lol.

Oh my God I'm dying. These comments (on another YouTube video I was watching with him):

He has the cutest talking voice! But it completely changes when he sings!😍

he kinda sounds like Gee.....(im assuming you know who Gee is based off of your name but just in case Gee is Gerard Way)

Y'know Helena is a real name

It's a super common name too. Wth lol. Their name was just Helena Karlstrom like just someone's name and they assumed it was a reference to this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UCCyoocDxBA

Yes My Chemical Romance are just that important.

[Nyctophilia]

The responses to this are largely "this is fake and never happens, but if it's real it's good patenting and more should be like this"

Based mother and father kick out son after he comes out as trans.

All these people are ghouls and should be cancel cultured severely

The account I QT'd is a hate account btw, block so you never see it again. Elon agrees with these people so why bother reporting

This world is a nightmare.

lol:



No but seriously it's terrible.

Yesterday I stumbled on someone insulting a trans guy's photos because their photos went viral the person insulting him compared him to lesbians saying something like 'they don't chop up their body and at least they can get laid' almost every single response to that tweet was then just some guy insulting lesbians and calling them ugly 'what did you see the lesbians in porn?' etc, except for one tweet which said that the guy insulting the trans guy should be castrated. I don't think anyone responding was trans and I don't think the people insulting lesbian women even cared about the topic (I looked through their bios + account to get an idea,) they'd just stumbled on the tweet and wanted to insult lesbians. I have very low expectations for twitter because it's the worst social media site imo besides possibly 4chan and even then it's prob tied, but I was wondering what kind of algorithmic nightmare just allows that to happen. Even by twitter standards the uniformity and sheer numbers of these comments was insane. Even most right wing transphobes are performatively larping as caring about homosexuals now lol so this was something else.

And the entire site is a [BEEP] show now constantly. Again it's always been awful but since January this year there are just a sea of white nationalist accounts with 10s of thousands - 100s of thousands of followers spouting off racist and anti semitic crap constantly.

This is heart breaking, Even if it turned out this particular one was not real and no reason to think its fake, this definitely happened to others.

I know multiple people who have been told essentially this by their parents

Best case scenario for most people is like your dad saying 'I won't chuck you out but I'd prefer it if you're not gay. Also don't let gay people trick you into being gay because that sometimes can happen.' Which is what mine told me when I was a teenager. Trans and non-binary people wasn't even something he was aware of or thinking about back then. I don't think he'd be OK with that now though but I think he'd stay in denial about it as long as possible if I came out. Or he'd go completely batshit either/or. It's hard to say and I often imagine things being bad and they somehow end up even worse. I think he thinks I'm asexual now? He watched a soap opera years ago I dunno. I think my mum just wouldn't get it and ignore the matter unless I medically transitioned. But again it's hard to say. She's not homophobic but a lot of people are transphobic and I dunno her opinions about that. My dad is homophobic in the purest emotional sense where I was once watching Jennifer's Body on the TV during the scene where the two female characters make out on the bed and he just came in the room then and was like 'ew gross.' (This must have been during the short window where I'd moved back in after uni, and before he moved out after he went to prison, tbh surprised it was on TV then because it usually takes forever and I watched that at the cinema when it came out in like 2009? Yes 2009. It's been so long omg. That was prob like the day after.. No this is already off topic lol a lot was happening in late 2009 for me lol,) and he's used slurs for gay men in the past. He's not against gay marriage or being gay legally though.

Also randomly had 9 notifications on tumblr which is very unusual. It's only showing 4 things though so not sure why there were 9 notifications. 3 of those I'm pretty sure are just random bot accounts following lol. (You can tell because of the avatars and completely empty accounts. Also it's not instagram so if someone has a professional quality photo of themselves and they're conventionally attractive + gender conforming + the photo isn't stylised at all there's a 99% change that's a bot. The other 1% is Ryan Reynolds. 1 of the approx. 3 famous tumblr posters. It's not really 1% either it's more like 0.0000 something or other but yeah lol.)

[Nyctophilia]

I never send my friend music because he basically only listens to Muse and Queen oh yeah and also likes this one Marina and the Diamonds track (which I also like also a bunch of Muse songs and some Queen tracks but I'm not picky with music lol,) but I was like this song is just so good though (I first listened to it like a month or more ago but was like listening to it while cooking and then was like this is really good. So I randomly felt like linking this.) Anyway he was like

Very important I know but this is the Marina and the Diamonds track I was talking about btw. Because he likes low pitched female vocals (in fairness I guess Rush - esp early Rush - is the polar opposite of that haha.) I also like her voice a lot here (and the song would otherwise be quite boring for me I think,) but yeah he's so picky. It's like me with finding men attractive.




-------------------------------------------------


(unrelated to above)

...Wait what? He talked to Aella lol (haven't watched this video yet)



Right wingers really want to be autistic so that at least should drift over time in that direction.

Another thing is a lot of mental illnesses correlate with each other so you're more likely to have several of them at the same time. And there are a whole bunch that are very similar to each other in a lot of ways. Also sociopathy isn't technically a mental health disorder antisocial personality disorder is and this chart is missing most of the personality disorders for some reason. Autism and ADHD aren't mental health disorders either lol.

Anxiety disorders might not be reported often by people with ASPD but they are comorbid especially social phobia (it's not so weird aggression can be one response to anxiety.) ADHD is also comorbid with ASPD and substance abuse disorder is comorbid with both. Conduct disorder and oppositional defiant disorder are common in young people with ADHD who then often go on to develop ASPD (they don't like to diagnose ASPD in children except in extreme cases.)

https://www.sciencedirect.com/scienc...65178102003207

The association between lifetime anxiety disorders, conduct disorder (CD), and antisocial personality disorder (ASPD) among adults in the community was explored. Data were drawn from the National Comorbidity Survey (n=5,877), a representative community sample of adults aged 15-54 in the 48 contiguous US states. Multiple logistic regression analyses were used to determine the association between anxiety disorders, CD and ASPD, and between the co-occurrence of anxiety disorders and ASPD in the likelihood of comorbid substance use and affective disorders, suicidal ideation (SI) and suicide attempt (SA). Out of the 3.3% of adults with ASPD, over half (54.33% ) had a comorbid anxiety disorder (lifetime). Similarly, 42.31% of adults with a history of CD (9.4% ) who did not meet criteria for ASPD had a lifetime anxiety disorder. Social phobia [OR=1.65 (1.01, 2.7)] and post-traumatic stress disorder [OR=2.28 (1.3, 4.0)] were associated with significantly increased odds of ASPD, after adjusting for differences in sociodemographic characteristics and other psychiatric comorbidity. Major depression was no longer significantly associated with ASPD after adjusting for anxiety disorders. The comorbidity of anxiety disorders and ASPD was associated with significantly higher odds of major depression, substance use disorders, and SI and SA compared with odds among those without both disorders. These data provide initial evidence of an association between PTSD and social phobia and an increased likelihood of ASPD among adults in the community, after adjustment for comorbid affective and substance use disorders. Adults with ASPD and comorbid anxiety had significantly higher levels of comorbid major depression, alcohol dependence, and substance dependence and substantially higher rates of lifetime suicidal ideation and suicide attempts compared to adults with ASPD or anxiety disorders alone or with neither disorder. Future studies are needed to replicate this finding using longitudinal data and to investigate the possible mechanisms of the observed links between anxiety disorders and ASPD.

There was a study on Finnish adolescents who were trans or non-binary and they found that young trans people were more likely to have been bullied but also to bully others and non-binary people were more likely than trans people to have been bullied and to bully others (which reflects hierarchical positions in society where non-binary people are less integrated than binary trans people, but both are less integrated than cis people):

https://www.frontiersin.org/articles...20.612424/full

Adolescents involvement in bullying is common (Kaltiala-Heino and Fr?jd, 2011; Lessne et al., 2016), and whether this is as a victim or as a perpetrator, it has well documented negative associations with health and educational trajectories (Chan and Wong, 2015a). Being bullied has been associated, for example, with depression and suicidal ideation (Liang et al., 2007; Kaltiala-Heino and Fr?jd, 2011; Heikkil et al., 2013) and school truancy and impaired academic performance (Wormington et al., 2016). Being a bully has likewise been associated with depression (Klomek et al., 2008; Kaltiala-Heino et al., 2009; Kaltiala-Heino and Fr?jd, 2011) and suicidal ideation (Kaltiala-Heino et al., 1999; Heikkil' et al., 2013), but also with delinquency and substance abuse (Liang et al., 2007).

They had some association with 'delinquent groups' which encourage such behaviour, and it's similar with certain racial minorities imo.

Further, being bullied is commonly associated with perpetrating bullying (Cook et al., 2010; Shetgiri et al., 2012; Chan and Wong, 2015b). Those victimized themselves may reactively bully others or perpetrating bullying may be a way of defending oneself. On the other hand, aggressors often socialize in antisocial groups where delinquency occurs, thus elevating the likelihood of being victimized themselves (Jennings et al., 2012). Perpetrating bullying may therefore arise from having been victimized or vice versa.

In the case of trans and non-binary people they are more likely to have anxiety disorders so it tracks that way too. Racial minorities are less likely to be diagnosed with mental health issues than white people, though. What I take from all of this is that the lower in status you are the more 'mental health symptoms/disorders' you will have I'm sure. It's easier to be more relaxed and less sociopathic in certain environments and also to compensate for certain things, and to get away with various things.

If you do a survey online everyone will be more mentally ill because the kind of person who spends a lot of time online, in political discussions, and/or taking surveys like this online is more likely to be mentally ill. Aella gets ridiculously high rates of mental health disorders, ADHD etc, in women in her sexology surveys from what I've noticed.

The far right is made up online of larpers who are edgelords who obviously would like people to think they have ASPD and want to shock people, and who do have more symptoms of that disorder at the same time, (trolls have more ASPD/'dark triad' traits.) Like you can stumble on someone on twitter who is like a Nazi trans woman who is claiming to be a pedophile and so yeah. Just being as edgy as possible with everything that might piss someone off. (They overplay their hand though because 'how could someone possibly be all these things at the same time?' However it works well on twitter of course, because people want to justify bigotry or push some other agenda and don't care about legitimacy at all while doing that 9/10 so it's the perfect environment if you just want an emotional reaction from people.)

Just a ton of issues yeah lol.

The compass is also fairly trash as a measure of politics.

But back to Green Day 😂 (an interview from a decade ago. 5 decades in 5 hours):



'I like every succeeding album more than the one before'

Hmm I stopped listening mostly after American Idiot which was definitely their most commercially successful and ambitious album imo and I liked that one though it got a lot of criticism at the time because they attracted a more mainstream audience. I have listened to a small handful of later songs and didn't think much of those. They were OK but yeah. I think Insomniac also stood out to me as having some interesting tracks in hindsight and also the heaviest I think.

This one especially quite interesting:





I loved singing to this like this line 'before it might have made some sense, but now it's all fucked up!'



Some great bass on some tracks.



'I must insist on being a pessimist'

And their best album cover by far lol.

I like Warning a bunch but I don't think it's better than Nimrod (the previous album.) It's hard to rate some of the early ones though because I like a bunch of tracks from all of them. Warning also has some of my favourite Green Day songs lol like this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TzZAYnoMLUI

And again Nimrod has a few interesting tracks where they went outside their comfort zone slightly. This track uses the harmonica:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Requxw6002g

This was written for Kerplunk apparently (and it kind of shows):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ATkdYngGQc

I doubt I'd think 21st Century Breakdown is better than American Idiot though even if I listened to it in it's entirety. American Idiot was this huge pop-punk rock opera.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JMcNzjzw63I

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sX3ve_1vRA8

Nope press x to doubt lol.

Their first album didn't really work for me. I never go back to that and can't think of a single song I like from it so that's my least favourite. There are a few songs I like on Kerplunk (second album though.)

Especially this one because again bass (maybe their best bassline):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7XYU7uoN_tI

This is actually me with music, gender and sexology (including talking to myself):

[Nyctophilia]

Bill Maher brought up this song as being his favourite:



Yeah it's lighter. Feels like Green Day's Black Parade era (though that's ironic because Black Parade was MCR's most commercially successful record and was also their American Idiot era.) Black Parade has more edge/anger than the above song though even then.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pyi0ZfuIIvo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=95hfNjZictY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fjpaZQwr30I

Despite not being my favourite MCR album (prefer the first two, though I do think this album is probably technically better just more of a personal relationship with the first two.) I can't deny it was incredibly culturally important and also as a kind of milestone. Because I think it marks the last time the media and others freaked out about young people in an indirect way (and also with associated music. As has been pointed out by many people social media really changed the way music worked for people subculturally. I guess there's kind of hyperpop now though?):

Why no child is safe from the sinister cult of emo - The Daily Mail, 2008.

And hoards of Mexican teens beating up emos etc (similar things in other parts of the world.) They often used emo as a proxy for gay and trans (if you listen to the reasons given for most of the people who were beating people up it was essentially 'these guys are GNC',) and that evaporated for gen z they're just going straight after trans + non-binary people now and like 'these are the new emos' 😏 'Go back to being emo etc' Nope (except in a nostalgia/historical sense,) that label was forced on me and you never liked us anyway.

Also almost everyone preferred the first three albums like one or more of them. Their fourth album was a bit of a departure and I'd sort of lost interest by that point due to age. I heard one of their songs while drinking at a uni house party (yes I will blame it on the alcohol but actually if it was the same party - and it might not be same house though - I did get very wasted much later on,) and was like wondering who it was so I asked this girl who lived at the house 'is that Pink?' and I have no idea how I thought it was Pink and this girl was like 'no it's MCR...' And that blew my mind. Still though how the [BEEP] did I think it was Pink? 😂 'Yo Pink's new album is lit.' I don't remember the song either probably Na, Na, Na:



I suppose there is this song right? So maybe it's not such a leap.



It's a really good song though I like it a lot. But yeah anyway so as I said basically nobody would say this album was their favourite so I love that Strange Aeons said that (I get why though like she's considerably younger so I think she must have been 12? When that album came out where as I was 13 when I got into their music and it was just after their second album had been released.)



Last Night on Earth is an OK song, piano is decent, but I'm not really into it. I have to be in a certain mood I think to enjoy that kind of thing in general, but also depends on the band/musician.